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Farmers Lab Advanced Theories and Techniques - Got a few grows under your belt and want to discuss more advanced theories and techniques? Discuss these matters here.

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Old 10-01-2008, 01:16 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Question ISO2 Isomerizer

I have an ISO2 isomerizer, made by Thai Power Incorporated. It was made in 1974, and uses alcohol to extract THC and essential oils from marijuana. There were no instructions with it when I found it. I researched it and found that it creates a zero oxygen environment, which causes cannibinoids to take on a molecule of carbon, becoming THC. It also uses "isomerization', essentially adding a small amount of Sulphuric acid which converts the THC to THC-delta-9. My question is does anyone have experience with this machine? I have researched it for years, and I have the formula down in every way but the amount of acid and the time needed for isomerization. I have made hundreds of grams of hash oil, and every now and then the oil was so potent most people (including myself) essentially got so high it was unbelievable. If anyone has some info, it would be greatly appreciated!!! I hope there are some old school heads out there who can help me. Thanks in advance for any help.
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Old 10-19-2008, 04:36 AM   #2 (permalink)
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You use 1-2 drops of Sulphuric Acid for every cup of Alcohol/Oil mix and heat 1-2 hours. You use a little more acid and add time if you are doing a "full load" of finely ground stuff vs. loosley cramming a couple ozs of leaves for a small run.

Also, if you want to clean the oil up, simply mix your neutralized alcohol solution (after adding baking soda) to an equivalent measure of water and stir well. Then add about a 1/3 equivalent measure of toluene (an industrial solvent available on inet) and stir well. Quickly place all in a separatory funnel and stir well (A Ring Stand to hold the funnel is VERY helpful). Let it sit for a few minutes, and the Alcohol/Water/Chlorophyll/Contaminant (the "green" part of the mixture) will separate out to the bottom of the funnel. You should now have a light greenish layer on the bottom of the Sep Funnel, a layer of Toluene is next, and your oil is mostly floating on the top of that. Simply bleed off the alcohol/chlorophyll etc mixture, put it back in the iso2 with a glass in the soxhlet basket and reclaim your alcohol on low heat for your next run.

Throw the "green slime" left in the bucket away, its just water and contaminants. Now separate the toluene/oil mixture with the iso2, then when you have most of it separated, open the iso2 in a well ventilated area on high and burn off the remainder of the toluene. You'll be left with beautiful black oil with none of that crappy green tinted plant "goo" in it. Hope this helps.

Last edited by elric40; 11-08-2008 at 01:39 PM. Reason: added 1 step to process after going thru notes
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:12 AM   #3 (permalink)
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sounds like an interesting process. is it too much to request a couple pics of the thing?
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:42 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I can't figure out how to post a pic, so I made it my avatar.....you might be able to see it ok.....
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:44 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Thumbs up picture

I just made it my avatar......just click on my username and you'll see it
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Old 10-19-2008, 05:46 AM   #6 (permalink)
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cool. chemistry is fun
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Old 10-19-2008, 06:02 AM   #7 (permalink)
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Ya, also, remember to use REAGENT GRADE Sulphuric Acid, NOT the stuff you put in car batteries... and DON'T FORGET to neutralize it after heating with 1/8 teaspoon+\- of FRESH baking soda per drop of acid. (just add it like adding a pinch of salt to food....) just add slowly and stir until it quits fizzing, then add 1 more 1/8 teaspoon to make darn sure.

The toluene process will eliminate any extra soda taste.....
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Old 10-19-2008, 08:53 PM   #8 (permalink)
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yes this is very intresting(=
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Old 10-19-2008, 09:56 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Very fuckin cool. Any good links for a "noob" to this?
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Old 10-19-2008, 11:27 PM   #10 (permalink)
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looks like a ray gun.
APPROVE.
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Old 10-20-2008, 12:18 AM   #11 (permalink)
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lol APPROVE! that sounded funny in my head.

This machine looks awesome though. Does anyone still make them (or a similar product)?

Edit: Did a quick search and found an old magazine article. Just do a Control+F for "isomer", or it's like 1/6 of the way down.
http://www.textfiles.com/magazines/T...OCK/ts-100.txt

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I'm only saying that for isomerizers to work, you must use hemp with its CBD [cannabidiol], not marijuana.
Is that true?
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Old 10-20-2008, 05:43 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Nope....no more isomerizers, and this was the only one that really worked. It's basically a sealable stainless steel coffee pot with a pressure release system. The spun aluminum top is a slightly inverted cone on the bottom. You put Ice in the bottom of the aluminum top and when the hot alcohol (gas) rises up, it cools a little (turns into liquid) and immediately runs down to the center, and drips into the product in a basket....just like a coffee pot

It's entirely safe to use as long as you don't smoke around it.....duh. You can find 1 or 2 a year on ebay listed as "essential oil extractors".

The quote above is from a link where the author states that there is only about 3% unconverted CBDs and CNBs in "average" low to mid-grade pot. Isomerization is supposed to change these and THC into delta-9 THC (the "trippy" THC), so his theory is that there is not much there to convert, and that hemp actually has a higher percentage of these unconverted chemicals, so would produce better oil. Back in the 70's, we were told that there was like 15-20% unconverted CBN's etc, so there would be a vast improvement from the crappy pot to the oil quality.

I'll have to say this interests me to the point that I am going to try 2 batches the next time I fire it up. I'll leech, then use the acid, neutralize and separate as usual. The second batch, I'll just leech and separate and see if there is appreciable difference.
I've also toyed with the idea of using 100% strength citric acid (VERY EXPENSIVE) to see if it would do anything or maybe improve the taste.........I'll let you know if I ever get around to it.

Like scooter said though......I can add 1 gram of clean oil to a pizza paste, cook a medium pizza and share it with 6 people, and we get so high we don't even want to move. It's a different kind of buzz. Really "Slyder".......type buzz. (Your feet "slide" when you walk..... )

You see, this machine does 2 things: it removes/leeches EVERYTHING out.....then you go about your "isomerization" process. Key here is the Toluene process for removal of what I call "the green slime".....it is just contaminants...mostl y chlorophyll that makes the oil harsh which was it's downfall as a consumer product.....along with some really outlandish statements as to what you could do with the machine. It was sold as a machine you could put the crappiest pot in and get excellent oil and/or make hash which just isn't true.

WHile I've never been able to make great hash with it, I can add 1 gram of this oil to 4-5 grams of the low- midgrade bubble hash - I smash it in with a mortar & pestle, then put it all in a hash press, and wow.....it really kicks it up a notch and it's not messy...........

You have to remember that this thing came out in the mid 1970's and the only really applicable reference book you could readily get back then was "Cannabis Alchemy" which is still a good reference. There was no internet or other readily available good reference materials. Only a very few people ever stuck with this machine, and finally figured out how to use it and then clean the oil up just a few years back. You can now google up isomerizer and there is a picture of a lab setup as this process was invented/discovered back in the late 1800's!

If you just followed the instructions that came with the machine, you ended up with this dark green/brownish goo that would get you high, but it was unattractive and harsh. And oil is a bit messy anyway.....you have to prepare a place....I use a newspaper on a coffee table, dip a large paper clip into the oil, then hold it over some ashes in a pipe or bong, while holding the opposite end of the paper clip, heat it with a lighter closer to the end with the oil. IN a few seconds, the paper clip heats up, and a drop of oil falls onto your ashes, ready to smoke and is one nice sized hit. Hint: leave a bottle of rubbing alcohol close, it will clean any oil off your hands or pipe...whatever

It's gonna be a few months, but I'm getting ready to also make a run with some high grade trimmings AFTER making bubble hash....just to see what I get....because this process leeches EVERYTHING out of the leaves....nothing but brown hay left

Funny story.....back in the 70's, I showed this to a guy who liked the oil...he talked me out of some of the "hay" leftover leaves. I'm sure he was gonna add it as an "extender" to some crap he was selling.........anyw ay, he got pulled over on the way home and the cops found those leaves. They cuffed him and got him for a dui, but had to drop all drug charges against him because there was NO thc in the sample....nada....th ere are a half dozen cops still scratching their heads about that one after 30 years.........

ANyway, I'm not a chemist, but I know this machine works to make great oil. I've never been able to get it to do anything else. You can, however make up to about 20 grams of nice stuff in a long day if you stay with it. I do it while I'm doing chores around the house...you only gotta screw with it every couple of hours and 1/2of that time is waiting for it to cool so you don't lose your expensive alcohol when you open it...........

FYI, years ago (before bubble hash), I started just placing nice trimmings in a mason jar full of "freezing" alcohol for 10-15 minutes, shaking 3-4 times, then put it in a shallow dish on low on electric stove with a fan close by until alcohol evaporated. The cold alcohol would remove the trichromes etc, but not have time to leech into the plant and bring the chlorophyll with it. It's good, but you don't get much and it is wasteful of the alcohol.

ps. I only use everclear which is 190 proof = 95% alcohol. Before I ever start a run, I simply use the isomerizer to separate the alcohol from the 5% water. You just set a glass in the basket, put it on low and the alcohol comes out first, so then I start my run with 100% pure and "safe" alcohol. It tastes a lot better after isomerization than isopropyll, and I've never had the balls to try wood alcohol or acetone, though I've heard others do it to save a buck or 2 (shudder)..........

Anyway, it is a cool relic that actually does work, ya just need a little common sense. It is a high quality, sturdy machine. The damned thing cost me almost $200 34 years ago! Mine still has the ORIGINAL light bulb (heat source) in it and IT STILL WORKS!!!!! so good luck. I've rambled enough, but if anyone has questions, I'll be glad to answer them to the best of my ability.

Last edited by elric40; 10-21-2008 at 08:29 AM. Reason: misspell
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Old 10-20-2008, 06:26 AM   #13 (permalink)
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wow, epic post.
what other conventional ways are there to extract THC from Marijuana?
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Old 10-20-2008, 07:40 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Well, the "boffo" butane (honeybee extractor) process produces extremely clean oil quickly.

The most popular now is probably the bubble hash process that just freezes the trichromes and uses cold water (and ice) to wash and knock the trichromes off high quality trimmings. Water doesn't leech out the chlorophyll like the ISO2 does.

Both of these methods are just for removing trichromes off of Sinsei Buds or High Quality trimmings, so you gotta have $$$$$$. The ISO 2 works with this and also lesser quality product.

I personally think I could take the high dollar product leftovers after either of these methods and STILL make some decent oil (as compared to regular product oil ) ..........I'm gonna find out soon.

(added after original post) I dunno what make this work, I suspect it is the added oils extraction out of the leaves etc.... I really don't. The oil, if you clean it. tastes smoky but neutral....NOTHING like good hash. I add to mid grade bubble hash that has a little flavor, but no punch. This gives it the "punch" believe me.

Last edited by elric40; 10-21-2008 at 11:24 AM. Reason: added information
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Old 10-20-2008, 09:09 AM   #15 (permalink)
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awesome post. you sound like quite the kitchen chemist
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Old 10-20-2008, 12:03 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Well, thanks Cerebro & C.C. (elric blushes)

I dunno, I made A's in Chemistry and Physics but with only a 2 year degree, so I'm no "Rocket Scientist"...... (mmmmm how 'bout "Cannabis Conniver? or Marijuana Maniac? ...ooooh! I got it..."Hash Oil Ho" .......) anyway, yeah this Iso 2 was just so cool.....I had to keep it all these years. I just broke it out after a 6 year hiatus, so I'll be making more posts soon...now all I have to do is get the cobalt tritanium nuclear particle accelerator built in the basement, then ................

But seriously....I usually don't post, but I saw this question about the ISO2 and wanted this info to be passed on as marihemp's website administrator (after 11 years) shut down his website last week. There was A LOT of information to be gleaned off that website. Of course, you can get all the info etc on a 3 dvd set with a tye-dye shirt (I AM NOT MAKING THIS UP) for $25 sent to USA addresses only. (I AM NOT MAKING THIS UP!) It's actually worth it if you can afford it, and will be unavailable one day................

Hey, I ain't crackin' on the guy....he's gotta make a living I suppose..........

Anyway, so now some of the info I am passing on here about the isomerizer cannot be found for "free" anywhere else on the web so propogate the message and the knowledge. All of you be students of history and teach the younger generations who will listen.............. .sermon ends now

(elric tokes a hit of AuroraIndica with a drop of hashoil on top and falls asleep......forever? )

nah, just being melodramatic..... more at 11...........

added after original post: "God, I wonder how many people in here know what "more at 11" means????????? " Dam I'm getting old.........

Last edited by elric40; 10-21-2008 at 09:06 AM. Reason: mis spell,last paragraph
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Old 10-20-2008, 03:08 PM   #17 (permalink)
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im going for my 4 year degree in math and chemistry so this stuff mentioned in this thread is pretty basic for me. i only wish i had one of these and a source of weed here in norway.
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Old 10-20-2008, 04:10 PM   #18 (permalink)
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that thing looks dangerously awesome.
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Old 10-21-2008, 05:19 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Well, FYI, if you want one, all you need is some patience and just place a "item wanted" add on EBAY. Not many people know what this thing is or does, and there ARE legal purposes that you can perform with this machine. Also, many owners have never advanced to the point of knowing how to clean the oil up, so think that it's a piece of hyped up crap that doesn't work, so they don't really know what they have. I think the reason that people ultimately hang onto them is that they are really sturdy....in others words, a REAL piece of equipment that you know could do something...you just don't know what.....you just gotta know how to use it to make really good oil, and if you use the original instructions, you never got really good oil....just "dark green sludge".

When they first started selling them around 1974 thru the Carter Administration (1976-1980), they didn't have many legal problems. They sold it "legally" as a perfume maker...... but the instructions still mentioned "weed" or "hashoil" offhandedly. Then when Ronald "Raygun" Reagan became President, local, State and Federal authorities all over the country began closing down headshops and just all around cracked down on stuff like this. The sellers then removed ALL reference to weed in the instructions. By this time, however; there were a few cheap imitators like the "KIK" machine which was totally worthless but only cost $75 +\-.......and with this expensive machine not doing all it said it would....the market left them and they all went out of business.

Like I said, it is high quality, very sturdy mostly stainless steel and aluminum. The Spun Aluminum Tower is full of Charcoal, so it doesn't even smell while its working! My Mom came over to my house unannounced back around 1980 and I had it running on the kitchen table....she asked me what it was and I told her it was a lamp but I broke the bulb.....it never came up again.......

If you want to buy one, just use the words "Thai Power Essential Oil Extractor" in the "Item Wanted" part of EBAY. They actually sold 2 on ebay in the last year and they both sold for under $250.

I remember there were 3 slightly different models produced at different times. The bases were the only difference. There was the most common one with a hard plastic Yellow-brown base (like mine)
One had a yellow-Orange kind of "feathered" Aluminum base that I suspect was just a regular one with the hard plastic shell left off so it was cheaper to manufacture (which got a little hot to touch when running on high) and the third had a hard Black Plastic base which was kinda cool (Darth Vader effect) and was only brought in the last couple of years of manufacture (I think). I'm kinda looking for one of those myself, but there weren't many of those made.........

Like CC said, the cleaning process is VERY simple. A seperatory funnel is just a funnel with a valve on the bottom. You can buy one and a ring stand for $100-$125 (get a glass or pyrex - NOT PLASTIC!!!) You can get toluene from places on the web. Reagent grade sulphuric acid is a little harder to get, but there are supply houses that sell to individuals, and a couple of ounces will last you the rest of your life.........

And as for product, just use a couple ozs of mid-grade stuff, you'll get 2 grams of cleaned oil per oz. You can smoke it like I described above which is very efficient and it will last you a long time (2-3 hits will sit you on a couch for 1 hour drooling on yourself)
or smear 2-3 "stripes" down the sides of a joint (which ALWAYS makes a mess....lol), or cook with it. It's already cooked, so just throw it in to your favorite food. I cook Hash oil spaghetti, burritos, brownies, pizza....anything... it's a blast....just don't plan on doing anything for a couple of hours.........(start out slowly with eating this stuff....it doesn't get into your system for 30-45 minutes depending on how much food is in your stomach... then you stay goofy for quite a while........)

Just remember to chop your product up really well, dry it thoroughly, and put a coffee filter on the bottom and top of your product in the basket inside the stainless steel "pot" so the hot alcohol spreads out evenly while leeching and you don't get "crumbs" in your oil.

If your basket ever breaks (and it will...it was the one weak link) just replace it with a 16.3 cm diam Stainless Steel Collander or strainer

Good luck

Last edited by elric40; 10-21-2008 at 11:34 AM. Reason: added info
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Old 10-21-2008, 06:58 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Oh, great picture, Flaming Nun. You can see the 2 springs on the sides that hold the top to the bottom. The black control button is hooked to a rheostat so it actually does work from "low to high". Also, the little light tells you if the heat source is on or off. You can also see alkali buildup on the center post in the "dish" shaped bottom. Thats from using tap water or tap water ice cubes in the cooling sink and can be easily removed with CLR. That won't happen if you use distilled water.

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