common sense

verklingen · 08-18-2009, 04:04 PM

so i've been pretty much inundated in this healthcare crap that's been going on, and i realized this and issues like it boil down to one thing: an individual's take on common sense. to a lot of people common sense is a tradition inherited generation to generation, and it can encompass all manner of notions. for some racism or some other bigotry is common sense. locking people up for drugs is common sense. all these things are very rarely questioned because most people never think to ask.

it seems to me that common sense is a very flimsy basis for an argument, or even for a belief. there's really no such thing as a common sense approach, because "common sense" only guides our behavior arbitrarily. and in that way, it can be a wise leader just as well as a treacherous ally. the reason is this: our world and the conditions we face are in a constant state of flux. it's impossible to adhere to one single, prescribed approach and find the success one expects from it.

but there's a difference in our situation today. we've been denying nature -- defying her winds and standing rigid amidst winds intended to help us grow stronger, more evolved -- for many, many centuries. in the the age of discovery and the following colonial age our haphazard ruckus exploded to fill all the world, and the industrial age thereafter set in motion a mechanism that seems, looking then to now, designed to refine the abruption. the consequences of this are now growing so severe that it's threatening the very institutions we depend on to provide a quality of life that we, looking at the other possibilities around the world, are ever so lucky to have. common sense could well end it.

we have enough history to look back and reflect on and more than enough creativity to abolish "common sense," be honest with ourselves and the things we want to achieve and discover a way of achieving them; without disrupting ourselves or anyone else. we really have an amazing potential. it's truly spectacular what we've done, even with all our shortcomings and hindrances (many of them self-made). a little critical thinking isn't too much to ask, and i really think that's all it'll take.

The Rev · 08-18-2009, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by verklingen

a little critical thinking isn't too much to ask, and i really think that's all it'll take.

Well, I guess we're doomed, then.

The Rev

rollingthunder · 08-18-2009, 06:47 PM

Ive never been a fan of the term 'common sense'....

after all, who is it common to?

and because no one seems to ask or question, we assume thought processes that are unquestioned to us, but may seem blasphemous or even offensive to another. But I think that the major flaw in everyone just thinking a little more to avoid stepping on other people's toes is that we think based off of what we personally call 'common knowledge' or 'common sense'.. so that base for us getting along may be flawed because not everyone is on the same page as far as thoughts, ideas and customs/ culture goes.

-Thunder

John F. Kerry · 08-19-2009, 06:07 PM

interesting, so probably growing up in a liberal family where people beleive that everyone should be given everything if they dont have it and not have to pay for it, is also what would pass as common sense for certain people right?

im interested also to know why you think health care for all is in some way the "natural" thing to have ?

if anything, natural selection is the natural thing to have...

verklingen · 08-19-2009, 06:19 PM

Of course! And likewise the notion that socialism must never work, under all circumstances. I see it a bit like trying to force a square peg in a round hole. Common sense as we use it encompasses a very narrow set of circumstances, and supposes/supplants a great deal of things which may be (and very often are) incompatible with the circumstances of reality (read: denial). Using any form of common sense exclusively is a really lazy way to approach life imo.

OldMan&TheWeed · 08-19-2009, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by John F. Kerry

im interested also to know why you think health care for all is in some way the "natural" thing to have ?

if anything, natural selection is the natural thing to have...

Yes, cancer, heart attacks, rotten teeth, infections, dying in childbirth. . . these are all natural things to have.

Antibiotics, antisceptics, toothpaste, fillings, spints. . . all unnatural.

The Rev · 08-19-2009, 08:19 PM

Why are antibiotics and such, or even polyester and nuclear energy unnatural? They are made possible by the laws that govern nature. They just took intelligence, rather than trial and error, to discover.

Personally, I think nothing is unnatural. Every action is part of the same aggregate process; every domino is struck by another, and strikes another, in the process of all of them falling.

The Rev

OldMan&TheWeed · 08-19-2009, 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by The Rev

Why are antibiotics and such, or even polyester and nuclear energy unnatural? They are made possible by the laws that govern nature. They just took intelligence, rather than trial and error, to discover.

Personally, I think nothing is unnatural. Every action is part of the same aggregate process; every domino is struck by another, and strikes another, in the process of all of them falling.

The Rev

I agree. I was trying to make the same point.