"The high office of President has been used to foment a plot to destroy the American's freedom, and before I leave office I must inform the citizen of his plight."
--John F. Kennedy, at Columbia University, 10 days before his assassination.
Protesters and police clash again? OFMFOMGOMOMFOMFOMFOG G ALERT TEH MEDIAZ!!!!!!!!
This was just a power struggle. Protests can be peaceful until they turn violent, simple as that. Good lord, research the pasts protests of civil rights and tell me this is something new or unheard of. While the police use a very heavy hand, the protesters use heavy hands as well. Both parties are guilty of inciting violence. There are fucked up people on both sides of the line and to deny that is to be biased to the upmost. The clash of these two groups do not herald the arrival of a police state, they exhibit the visceral pulse of our Democracy at work. Fact is, there is no Police State at work, just a symptom of the law vs. the people and it's been that way since the inception and subsequent balance of our young but rapidly growing Democracy.
AMEN.
I used to be a "conspiracy theory" nut too, like the original poster - until I starting ACTUALLY studying history (Not from school, OR from stupid conspiracy websites) , and learning what is REALLY going on in the world.
This is nothing new. This is nothing to be alarmed about. For fucks sake - I didnt see the authorities hurting anybody.
I saw a bunch of loud mouth trouble starters, being kept in line.
Sorry to be frank - but really - why would the police NOT be there to make sure nothing bad happens?
History Fact #73843: Sometimes, when people gather together and are very passionate about something, they committ crimes or assaults.
...thanks for the laugh along with the display of ignorance.
Funny, when I studied real history, I learned that in both ancient and modern times, relatively small criminal factions of people in key places of governments can very secretly achieve some very evil things, such as political assassinations, staged terror attacks, and CIA overthrows of regimes unfriendly to American "interests."
Ancient times: Nero's men set Rome ablaze, and blamed it on the Christians.
Modern times:
The Nazis set fire to the german parliament building, the Reichstag, blamed it on "communist terrorists," arrest many communists and pass anti civil liberties laws (The Enabling Act, not unlike our Patriot Act) and shortly thereafter open up the Dachau camp. Years later the nazis dressed one of their own in a Polish uniform, sent him to the Polish German border, and shot him, creating the appearance that Poland had dared attack the Reich; this was the false flag to launch the Euro part of WWII.
FDR, it is now clearly established, knew Pearl Harbor was coming and deliberately did nothing to stop it because American support for entering the war was dismal up to that point.
Gulf of Tonkin, a fabricated event to get us into Vietnam. Never really happened.
Operation Northwoods: Never carried out because JFK rejected it, but senior military generals would have, if JFK had approved, staged terror attacks in American cities and more, to blame on Cuba as an excuse to overthrow Fidel.
Operation Gladio: Attacking civilians to justify greater security, a NATO operation with heavy CIA involvement.
These are just a few of many things that are declassified and on the record, not theory. The catch: they don't get declassified until decades later when few if any people would actually protest about it; Northwoods for example was 1962 and not declassified in 2001, only to be given one mention on the national news before going down the collective memory hole.
Oh, and as for 9/11: The case for a false flag operation gets stronger by the year. You're probably not aware that active explosive material has been found in the WTC dust, this has been scientifically analyzed and has passed peer review in a scientific journal. Until another group of scientists challenges these findings and the challenge passes peer review, then the paper's findings are unchallenged in the scientific community. This serves to function in tandem with the fact that almost 1000 architectural and engineering professionals have signed the ae911truth.org petition which unequivocally rejects the official explanation of the WTC collapse. These people have the expertise, though truth be told it's really not more complicated than high school physics with regard to those building collapses, particularly Newton's Second Law of Motion.
Run along, history (and physics) lesson over.
"Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance." - Albert Einstein
__________________
"The truth will set you free. But first, it will piss you off." - Gloria Steinem
For fucks sake - I didnt see the authorities hurting anybody.
Okay, Mr. Apologist For Totalitarianism:
What do you call this?
By the way, even NBC news acknowledged that actual violent protesters are extremely few and far between at this G 20, with only a very small number of smashed windows, etc. Even the corporate media acknowledged that the protests are overwhelmingly peaceful and that the armed authorities (over 4,000) FAR FAR outweigh the number of protesters.
The "loud mouth trouble starter" and iconic anti war protester Cindy Sheehan was gassed and just got out of the ER. She just posted it on her facebook wall.
__________________
"The truth will set you free. But first, it will piss you off." - Gloria Steinem
No matter what, he thinks he'd be better off living without a government.
I used to think that too buddy - dont worry, your balls will drop and your mind will grow. Youll see things differently in a few years
Yeah you are right, there is no point arguing when there is clear evidence.
FOCUS. We're not talking about abolishing government, we're talking about abolishing police brutality and their role in taking away our rights. Have you even read the constitution? Do you know what that piece of paper is and means?
We can have government if you are so dependent on it that you couldn't possibly imagine living without it, just not a government like this that abuses its own people and steals from them and all the bullshit that goes on and then claims it for their own good and pretends nothing happened like with 9/11. WTF AMERICA?
__________________
We have to learn to unlearn
Its not contradictory, its amendment
Not everything we see is reality
Not everything we hear is the truth
Not everything we're taught helps us grow
Well, now first off, I don't think anybody here is a 'nut' (maybe Flappy). I really respect Kamee and his activism and level headedness. What I don't have tolerance for is pure negativity, like zerdown's broken record of "wake up america", which doesn't contribute a dinglesberry's worth to the conversation or our progress.
It's clear that there is darkness at work here and has been for a long time. I believe everything Kamee posted about government involvement with "false flag" operations since the dawn of recorded history. For me, I'm on the same page with that perspective. Conspiracies are a slippery slope, though. If you believe one, you need to take them all into account. And there's really no stopping point with it all.
The idea of 'nothing new under the sun' is actually proven by Kamee's quick summary of our history above. Supermarket is right; there is no need to be alarmed. This is not the end of America nor is the end of mankind, civilization, the world a we know, etc.. What this is the end of, is the ability for government's to perform these operations without being caught. What's ending is our ignorance or perhaps innocence to this information. What is ending is our misinformation.
The reason I don't get intimidated, upset or outraged at what is happening is because not only do I realize it's just the 'same ol', same ol', but I feel there is a global cleansing of this dark power, facilitated by our new-found ability to share information globally and instantaneously. There is no 'big brother', we are big brother. We can now expose them at every corner they turn. It's a beautiful thing. I think evidence of the Bush Memos being released are the heaviest piece of evidence to support this theory. Technically, Bush had everything place to effectively take over all branches of government, institute martial law, raid peoples homes and detain anybody with no cause for an indefinate amount of time. If there was ever going to be a police state, it would have happened then, when everything was ripe for the taking. Yet, it didn't happen. Why? I feel because it wasn't allowed to by the people. We knew (and know) too much now. Their plans are just plans and they are not coming to fruition because they are being foiled by our constant awareness of what is happening at every moment.
So really, anybody who is a perpetrator of that information, whether it's Alex Jones, Kamee, CNN or Jon Stewart...they are all blessed pieces to this puzzle as we all are. There's nothing wrong with believing in conspiracy theories...just don't get depressed or pessimistic, because if you really feel this is "the end", you're highly arrogant to think that your generation is the one that will end anything. No, be happy and exuberant instead...the world going through a process of self actualization. We are finally catching up to the lesson that history has been trying to teach us and we're doing it through this miraculous and rapidly evolving invention called 'communication.'
__________________
There's a door open to walk through
All I want is just beyond
What if I could let my guard down
Into freedom, on and on
Last edited by Ego Tripping; 09-28-2009 at 09:14 AM.
wow this thread sure has had a lot of posting without much progress. . . even though j wonder is nowhere to be seen! uncanny
people are mixing up their perceptions on this issue imo. the crowd-controlling actions taken by law enforcement are being treated as a symptom of our corrupt government's march toward total control over every aspect of our lives. it's very easy to make such a shocking accusation and post up videos of someone being arrested or gassed to drive the point home, but that's at best ignorant if not disingenuous, and at worst willfully deceptive. it's sensationalism that does no one any good at trying to figure out the truth of what's actually going on.
so what's going on? it's obvious that there is oppression, but oppression of what? that's the question and that's where one's opinion on other perceived government oppressions can muddy the waters. so what is it; is peoples' right to speak and be heard being oppressed, or is it oppression of unlawful expression -- to the point where other peoples' lives are unnecessarily infringed upon -- of that right? i maintain that we will not know until protests are carried out in a self-dignifying way rather than a self-aggrandizing way, but as long as there is a clear path for lawful protest with abundant avenues to get the message out and be heard i will have to assume that the problem is not with the law, but with the protesters; that it is oppression of an uncivil method rather than oppression of civil rights.
you can talk until your blue in the face about this or that government conspiracy but it won't change the fact that we ample opportunity to express our civil rights without infringing on the rights of others, and that therefor we are absolutely empowered to get whatever message out which we feel is important without inciting displays such as this which, if anything, take away from our intended message. still think protesters don't incite anything? i'll have to respectfully disagree and continue enjoying my life with all the freedoms you say i'm losing. i'll make up for it by lauding the better stories you have to tell when we meet up at the fema camps
__________________
History shows again and again how nature points up the folly of men
No matter what, he thinks he'd be better off living without a government.
I used to think that too buddy - dont worry, your balls will drop and your mind will grow. Youll see things differently in a few years
You know, I'm not sure I agree with Kamee either, but I disagree with putting words in his mouth more.
__________________
I never told anybody this but a thousand years ago I used to look up at the moon and dream about being an astronaut. I just never had the grades. Or the physical endurance. Plus I threw up a lot and nobody liked spending a week with me.
Lets spark this up again: Assuming, as jcp said, that "Public space(s) are for the use of ALL, not for the monopolization of a single group, regardless of their message. ".
Wouldn't political campaigns be an illegal gathering? I mean they are in most cases, closing entire streets for the monopolization of their single groups. Shouldn't our tax dollars be put into work by sending police squads to suppress these campaign rallies and shit for our safety? Shouldn't police beat up and throw tear gas at these criminals who are committing an illegal act?
Your thoughts yahookans?
__________________
We have to learn to unlearn
Its not contradictory, its amendment
Not everything we see is reality
Not everything we hear is the truth
Not everything we're taught helps us grow
when has a campaign rally shut a city down, forced schools to close or created riots? the comparison is a bit of a stretch as they don't really disturb the peace in and of themselves. do they often take place in streets?
i see what you're getting at, though the question might be better asked in regard to parades. still, the objection doesn't seem reasonable
__________________
History shows again and again how nature points up the folly of men
More contemporary, shouldn't G20 be an illegal event? Being that a whole city was virtually shut down for the monopolization of their own little group.
I mean, shouldn't the police beat them up and throw tear gas at them and not the protesters?
__________________
We have to learn to unlearn
Its not contradictory, its amendment
Not everything we see is reality
Not everything we hear is the truth
Not everything we're taught helps us grow
police state? and i thought i was getting ready to enjoy a weekend with my family, fuck! the stormtroopers were kind enough to let me post before taking me to the fema camp, though
it's monstrous what's been done but 5+ years ago the only avenues for illuminating these atrocities caught on film were badly designed black/tiled background websites with colorful text or p2p filesharing. now we get to embed such videos directly to any place on the web we wish to share it, and internal investigations sparked from videos uploaded to sites that depict abusive conduct are commonplace.
not the happiest set of circumstances but to say our country is dead is a bit of a stretch imo
But you have heard the term slippery slope? It's happening in small increments, and before you know it, you have the PD using real time google cameras looking at your private property w/out warrants just b/c they can, in real time to the point of facial recognition which is quickly developing (iPhoto has it already, although it is sketchy at best in my opinion). Oh, and I forgot which state or where I heard it, but there is one state (down south) that mandates a "neutral" emotionless expression for the purpose of facial recognition technology. Red light cameras. How can they really prove it was you driving as it just snaps a pick of your plate and time? You can't really fight it. There are a few examples that are happening.
__________________
I may not agree with what you have to say but I'll defend your right to say it to my death
But you have heard the term slippery slope? It's happening in small increments...
First they came for the communists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a communist;
Then they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist;
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a trade unionist;
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew;
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak out for me.
-Pastor Martin Niemöller (1892–1984), about the inactivity of German intellectuals following the Nazi rise to power and the purging of their chosen targets, group after group.
__________________
"The truth will set you free. But first, it will piss you off." - Gloria Steinem
uncanny
Linear Mode
