World of Lies

[The Rev]

There's no doubt that we all tell shitloads of lies every day. I don't mean lies which are intended to defraud, or even big lies, like denying that you've cheated on your significant other. I'm talking about daily lies, exaggerations, and other ways we bullshit ourselves and others on a regular basis.

Examples:
1. You know you can't afford that new inside out bubbler, so you tell yourself you will spend less next week and then you buy it anyway. Of course, you don't spend less next week, but you never did the last 1000 times you used that rationalization.

2. You tell your spouse she doesn't look fat, but she does.

3. You see a TV commercial in which people react to the taste of Brand X with a reaction bordering on orgasmic delight.

4. You get into some trouble, and you tell "your version" of the story.

5. You engage in unhealthy activities, then refuse to consider the long term potential consequences.

6. You think something is so, and another person explains to you why you are wrong. In spite of the explanation, you refuse to change your view.

7. Etc.

There are so many examples of lies and other self/other bullshitting in any person's given day, that they're beyond counting.

Now, I've thought long and hard about this, and it seems to me that we are bombarded by so much of this crap, that I wonder if most of us (unless we're very careful)don't live in a world existing somewhere between reality and fantasy. After all, if skewed messages make up a large portion of your daily intellectual intake, wouldn't they have SOME conditioning effect?

Lying and distortion of truth are big problems in my mind. I hate being unable to grasp the larger picture (in any situation) because another person's dissatisfaction with the truth (reality-based truth) gets in the way. I find the large void of what I don't really know (but might think I know) very frightening. Sometimes I think that facts, and even reality itself, don't matter to many people.

What thoughts do the rest of you have on this?



The Rev

[Chillsss]

I agree that we do live in a world of lies, and some are big, and some are not.

We use white lies to prevent others from hearing the hurtful truth. I often wonder what kind of society we would live in if there were no lies. Unfortunately, lying is something that everyone does on a daily basis without even noticing it. I find it amazing that a little bit of un-truthfullness can completely change something.

Rev, im not sure if this is what you are talking about, but it was my best guess

[koshiva]

Of course we live somewhere between reality and fantasy...in fact, probably more the latter, cause ya know, all reality is a sort of illusion, in the sense that, there is no 'absolute truth' regarding any aspect of existence. There are only forever evolving perspectives. A persuit of the unattainable, a multitude of layers,infinity...li ke the universe itself.

Certainly,even though reality is an illusion,there are varying degree's of 'knowing',or wisdom regarding the various layers of perception, regarding the whole world and ones place in it. People evolve spiritually(concious ly) at different rates and in different directions based upon experience and many other factors. Now if you are fed a diet of deliberate lies,deliberate distortions then you will simply stop evolving and perhaps become even more ignorant,and then go on to infect others with this denial of process. Which really is the intention of some...the ones who conciously decide to decieve,on the basis that, they are the custodians of wisdom/knowledge and therefore must protect their supremacy and 'look after' their brethren.

Cause there are so many layers to conciousness, any one who has ever 'tripped' would have seen...not all,but many...but to have seen,and to have recognised even still, the sheer limitations of ones own knowledge despite the heightened vision is to see how very slight our understanding is. And yet we persist...it nags,bekons exploration...and what for? To seek truth? When you sense there may be no truth but only an infinite slope upwards why bother with the whole 'shaggy dog story'? And so, some 'choose' to switch off the light...it can be daunting trying to reconcile existence,so to retain ones own sanity,it is necessary to dwell therein with balance or not at all. And so, to be preoccupied,engaged in activity, so one can forget about the world,the universe and oneself is healthy,or it may drive you mad to be constantly in a state of angst about life...as many who seek often secumb to...just letting go completely.

The first step to knowledge in this age, is to learn how to swicth off the TV. But ya know, those who lie,and decieve...often seek power...and with that comes more and more lies.
Just trying to make an extra effor to be honest with oneself is good...to try and break through ones own self deception...the lies we tell ourselevs to justify ourselves. We'll never ever be 100% honest,but to strive toward that is sufficient.

Free the herb

[OldMan&TheWeed]

"You engage in unhealthy activities, then refuse to consider the long term potential consequences."

That's me!

[moldyorangepeel]

I don't think any of us live in fantasy. I think everybody knows the truth very well.

[ziplock]

Originally Posted by moldyorangepeel

I don't think any of us live in fantasy. I think everybody knows the truth very well.

How so?

[moldyorangepeel]

we're all from the same stuff and we know ourselves
and we do lie to ourselves

[moldyorangepeel]

so the living in fantasy ok yes i can see that
we try and fail to escape the truth

[Mescalito]

I was going to answer by first making the distinction between a lie to onesself and a lie directed towards other people. And then there is the distinction between a lie where the truth is not told and a lie where the truth is distorted.. usualy in ones favour. I guess its about deceipt and lies then/ So i really dont know what to say.. its difficult unless im talking about one of these aspects. For example is decieving oneself worse to do than to lie to someone? Of course it depends on the severity and implications of the lie.. but also on a million other things. Humans quite often will happily decieve themselves or let themselves be decieved. Err there was a point i was moving towards but i lost it in the void.

Matchu

[JcP]

I'm going to come back and edit this to add in more, but I keep gravitating to the concept that not all lies are equal.

Some lies stem from a need to survive "I didn't see your face, mr. gunman!!"

Some lies stem from shyness "hey...my name is....Bob?"

Some stem from a need to protect someone from pain "you're beautiful."

Some stem from anger "I never loved you."


You know? So I guess my question to add is whether living in a fantasy/reality is necessarily a bad thing or a mechanism developed by the human race to make life easier?

Either way, I'm not sure if the world would be better if people were all bluntly honest all the time. What good does it do to tell a retarded crippled kid he can't do anything the regular kids do? What good comes from telling your wife she looks fat in that dress?

Hrm...more to come. Little early to think hard.

[StillbornSavior]

Originally Posted by moldyorangepeel

I don't think any of us live in fantasy. I think everybody knows the truth very well.

Hehehe, you're silly. All of us live in fantasy. That's all we do. There is no thing but fantasy.

[North_of_Sanity]

Originally Posted by The Rev

5. You engage in unhealthy activities, then refuse to consider the long term potential consequences.

Yeah, most people are losers that way, and I used to be like that too.

I used to eat hamburgers and drink coffee and smoke cigarettes all the time, thinking it's making me happy because I'm indulging.....but then eventually it just hit me what a loser lifestyle it was, because ingesting crap simply makes you feel like crap, so why even do it at all?

Since I quit cigarettes and started dieting and exercising almost daily, the old gratification of instant indulgment has been replaced by the satisfaction of knowing I'm taking care of myself and just the energy level I get in general from being healthy.

I feel like 100x better in the morning, and I'm not grumpy all day, everyday like I used to be. I actually need a reason to be grumpy now, I've noticed such a difference in attitude, energy and motivation.

I still get baked pretty much everyday, but it's more of a habitual thing now that I do to enhance life (to get from normal to high), whereas before I did it simply to stop feeling like crap for a few hours. (from feeling like a bag of shit back to normal.)

[smoke]

i think we develop a life tolerance. we find a desire to break out of the ordinary and the literal. we stay grounded mentally, but choose to inject some theater into our lives to keep it interesting. its a constant experiment.. defining who we are by trial and error. its all just a crazy game.