The Rev

I just got back from applying for a Calif. Drivers License, after having an out of state one for nearly a decade. Part of it was having to take a written test. I got all the questions right but two, and here's one of the two:

I answered the last one, which seemed the least unreasonable of the three. Guess which one was right...

Unless this test is in error, the State of California takes driving a car as an instant waiver of your 4th Amendment rights. If Thoreau were alive today, he'd shit his pants.



The Rev

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Jewish Pork

Are you being forced to drive?
Is the alternative of you driving violence against your person?

Can you move from the state you live in?
Last time I checked they didn't have a wall, with armed guards, that kept you inside the state border (I've heard the exact opposite).


They do have buses, right?

my_scatterheart

so they shouldnt be allowed to test people who've been swerving all over like dunces because they didnt hit anything yet?

sounds grand

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Be mindful even if your mind is full. -J. De La Vega

The Rev

If you're swerving around, that constitutes probable cause, and an officer would then have the right. They shouldn't have the right to arbitrarily ask drivers to hand over bodily fluids on command.



The Rev

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The Rev

Are you being serious?



The Rev

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Sir-Ex

Ima side with Rev here. They should have a reason to test you first. Not necessarily as extreme as a collision, but at least see you driving poorly or something.



In terms of answering the question though, I'm surprised you'd pick the last one. It'd make no sense to only test people after an accident, the intention is to prevent accidents, not just punish accordingly. In Canada... or at least Alberta we have checkstops set up from time to time, and I think there they test your breathe whether you've been driving fine or not.

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Smile

Ditch the cigs!!!!!!

The Rev

In California, you have the right to bypass a checkpoint if you want (they usually have a sidestreet you can turn off on) specifically because of the 4th Amendment. They usually have a cop posted there to check you out, to make sure you're driving okay. The only reason I said collision was because it was the only other answer. "Only when you're drinking" is kinda ludicrous. Sometimes, with multiple choice, it's a process of elimination.



The Rev

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Roach

yea it's a bit fucked up.

even pennsylvania requires reasonable suspicion (which has replaced probable cause in most states), before suggesting a tox screen/field sobriety test.

and the sobriety test can be denied, however, that then provides reasonable suspicion that the driver is under the infuence of something, which can result in arrest.

california is definately considering the 4th amendment in the phrasing of the test question. They therefore require that drivers be willing to give up their constitutional rights, in order to posess a cali license.

This could also conceivably be overturned in supreme court, if anyone would be willing to dispute the requirements validity.

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לזיין את הקופים

Flamingnun

How many times have you heard about people being given sobriety tests for driving perfectly normally?

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The Rev

I wonder what the constitutional argument is to support forcing people to get a license in order to drive in the first place.

That and why we just take these things for granted, like that's the way things are supposed to be or something.



The Rev

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The Rev

It's not whether the cops do it or not, it's whether they have the right to do it; or, conversely, whether you and I have the right to say no to this invasion of privacy.



The Rev

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Waves

i still laugh at the whole idea of "inalienable rights" and all the stars and stripes bullshit they try to load into us as kids

we're all just cattle for the fucking govt

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On this life that we call home
The years go fast and the days go so slow

Terry

California is a fascist nanny state. I fucking hate it there.

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There must be quite a few things that a hot bath won't cure, but I don't know many of them.

-Sylvia Plath

Jewish Pork

I wasn't being rhetorical

Jewish Pork

How do they have the right to check for insurance then?

Personally, I feel like my private transactions with private businesses are pretty personal.

Jewish Pork

George Carlin actually had a really good comedy bit on this subject.

Geeno

In North Carolina you can refuse a breathalizer, lose your license for X amount of time or you can take it and get all sorts of fucked for X2 amount of time.

Pretty much you're better off refusing it here.

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Flamingnun

Of course you have the right to deny it, they can't force you to provide a sample, you'll likely just end up with instant license suspension instead.

When someones "privacy" can career across lanes and kill someone, it becomes everyone's problem. If you want privacy, avoid public roads.

I'm all for being able to breath test anyone anywhere.

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Jewish Pork

But it's his god given right to drive (intoxicated or not)!

my_scatterheart

the only people that ever bitch about this shit are bad drivers and people with duis. why would a cop test someone unless they had suspicion of them being fucked up? what? to embarrass you? to make you late for work? make you mad? give me a fucking break.

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Be mindful even if your mind is full. -J. De La Vega