verklingen

Well, i can give a couple examples.

Firstly, most beneficial aspects of a diet which includes meat are available in milk (milk is merely transformed blood).

Second, one of he major contributors to health problems in our society is cholesterol. The bulk of this cholesterol is gotten from meat.

I'm not saying that a human can't eat meat, I'm just saying that once one comes to understand that there is ample foodstuffs to be gotten everywhere around us he realizes that needlessly killing helpless animals just to fill his stomach is nothing but unneccesary malice.

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reverie

Is the lion killing the antelope for survival unneccesary and malice? Why do people seem to view this differently? Something to genuinely think on.
Perhaps this is due to the way we process and prepare food as a society today. Lean meats hardly contriubte to cholesterol problems.

Sure milk and other substitutes can give similar benefits as meat but how is it better for us biologically as you previously stated?

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verklingen

Its not necessarily "better," but wouldn't it stand to reason to believe that eating fibrous foods will keep one's digestive system running more smoothly and efficiently?

A lion depends on living animals as his sole source of food. Why do people view this as so similar to a human?

Really, I cannot understand this comparison. A dung beetle eats animal waste. We could eat animal waste too, but would it be beneficial to make it a major part of our diet?

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shylo666

^no we couldn't. the microbes in animal (or even human) feces would kill us.

and vegetarianism is not the best diet for humans. nor is dairy a natural part of it. until we became farmers (WAY after we were hunter gatherers) we had virtually no access to dairy foods. and dairy is the most complex food we have to digest. it often causes upset stomach and a huge portion of the population is actually lactose intolerant. if you're looking for the most unnartural, most harmful food that humans eat, it's not meat, it's dairy.

most, if not all, vegetarians take a supplement of some kind. women especially can run into trouble on vegetarian diets as they often fail to provide an adequate supply of vitamins and minerals such as iron and calcium, deficiencies of which can have serious implications. without supplements, which would not exist in a natural setting.

the best diet for humans is a mostly vegetarian diet, with meat making up about 10% or less. this is what our bodies are designed to handle.

TetraHydroCannabinol

I think cats kill mice for enjoyment, or maybe its instinct, but they dont do it for survival (usually, or maybe they would if we didnt give them cat food lol).

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Waves

If you really think our teeth are designed to eat flesh youve never tried chewing on the turkey flesh at thanksgiving dinner. now imagine that without fire. our teeth are designed to eat nuts, fruits and vegetables, and it is only because our digestive system allows the partial digestion of meat that we can live with it in our bodies for so long. the bottom line is that putting pounds and pounds of undigestable animal flesh into your stomach over time takes away precious resources from your immune system.

theres no personal bias involved, just scientific fact. we did NOT evolve eating meat, and if you eat too much of it you will get sick and die.
Theres so many definitions of "true" herbivore its not even worth arguing, imo. the only thing that matters is wether or not an animals digestive system is equipped with the correct parts to digest different things. this happens due to evolution, species evolve eating mostly the same thing. in our case we evolved *alongside* chimps from a common ancestor who ate nuts, fruits and veggies. all that doesnt matter though, all that matters is that animal flesh does NOT digest in your body and yada yada.

eat all the meat you want, i dont care. just realize that its unnecessary and unhealthy. im not going to knock anyone for it because MOST of the stuff we do im "modern" society is unnecessary and/or unhealthy.

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shylo666

have you ever taken a biology class including a unit on the digestive system in your life?

cause i'm majoring in bio....i know how the digestive system works. and it digests meat.

i'm sorry, but the bulk of your post is just wrong.

Waves

i said flesh, not meat.

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Waves

they are used to doing it for survival. a cat doesnt just kill a mouse and leave it for dead. it usually alerts what it thinks is its family so they can come and chow down. most humans naturally dont want a part of it. but rest assured the cat is just fulfilling its natural role, not taking enjoyment out of hunting another animal ala humans.

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Flamingnun

Best post in this thread so far.

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Waves

if you really think a humans body is "designed" to eat 10% meat you are rediculously stupid. sorry.

in case you havent noticed humans without tools cant hunt worth jack shit. we dont have claws, we dont have sharp teeth, we are slow and fat, and compared to most other predators have lackluster reflexes. we are natural vegetarians. we can process a small amount of meat in our digestive system. that doesnt mean we were "Designed" to eat a small amount of meat in our diet. that just means we can process small amounts of meat and stay healthy. just like you can smoke small amounts of cigarettes and stay healthy.

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Flamingnun

Well, aside from that part. id personally say 50/50, but thats just me

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Waves

ok,

im gonna get off my high horse because im just as guilty of eating meat as the next guy. i love the shit. but if i had to either slaughter a cow or eat a bunch of fruits and veggies for dinner id probably choose fruits and veggies.

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frendofthedevil

Bullshit.
Any idiot can get more than enough nutrients through a vegetarian diet, without even going near any supplements.

Home Wrecker

On a timescale as long as the universe what is the value of one life?

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osirus2020

Who gives a shit animals taste good, hey its better them than me

KGB

sad but true ^^^
that kitten video is fucking discusting i would kill that asian hoe. My brother showed me videos but it was pigs getting their throats cut and it was so sad, and seals get shot by fishermen. there is a lot of sick shit in this world and there is nothing you can do about it

Waves

you can do your part by not doing it

theres only sick shit because a bunch of humans said "well theres some sick shit out there, lets go hunt some seals."

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reverie

I sure hope not, lol. Why do you value the life of an animal? Why is it that you find it disheartening when an animal is killed? For me it's more about associations (refer to my first post), I'm not really addressing the method, but the intent. The intent of a lion killing an animal could be the exact same as a human, of course the methods will vary. Why does ones perspective change when it is another animal doing the killing rather than a human?

To me, this is because of the distinctions we've made the more we've observed our experience. The variations of it, and the different levels. For example when you said "A lion depends on living animals as his sole source of food." You separated the animal experience from the human, taking in to consideration certain factors (such as; resources, instinct and choice). These factors alone are pretty objective, they are then subject to change according to what emphasis or conditions you give them (or which topic you encorperate them into).

If for some reason we had no access to foods other than animal, would one view it wrong if we killed the animals for food in order to survive? It appears that if something is viewed as justifiable then it can be accepted. Killing for survival would be justified in that there are no alternatives- it is a neccesity. Whereas killing out of enjoyment or mass production is harder to justify. It is viewed as disrespectful, frivolous and self centered. Perspective changes given certain stimuli. Take the kitten for example, and the associations many recieve from kittens ("cute, cuddly, innocent"). Then take the act of killing and direct it towards the cat. This then seems completely unneccesary, malice and dishonorable- thus unacceptable. If we change the factors though, alot would change in perspective. Lets say that the kitten grows into a big fat cat then kills a pet hampster of ours. One would be more inclined to have a grudge towards the cat. They might feel that there is debt to be owed and therefore might see the killing of the cat as justifiable. The intent of this would be on revenge.

Intent is based around the associations made. Thus intent will vary from individual to individual dependant on their past experiences. Why do you or don't you eat meat? Everyone's answer would vary slightly because of this. We seem to do what works for us, and what best serves our current focus...

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Baise

all i know is MY body was not designed to survive solely off fruits and veggies.