ziplock

I've worked with many "spiritual" people of all kinds and I'm telling you that anyone that claims to be "spiritual" yet resorts to things like duality to separate their current life/circumstance from the "spiritual" is not a "spiritual" person.

Life, the totality of it, that is what's spiritual. Any method that claims to be spiritual is just a method to rekindle the spark between you and your lost love: life. Anyone that appears to be spiritual is just more in touch with life. Fuck your paper books, your priests, your prophets, and your promises. Give me real people living real lives.I tend to notice all kinds of differences when I'm taking drugs

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Insanity is the only sane reaction to an insane society.

Waves

i would honestly like bondi to attempt to define "spiritual" as opposed to "non spiritual"

__________________
On this life that we call home
The years go fast and the days go so slow

SageTree

I don't know that this is called for. There are many lessons in these books ect, and I feel that I have learned to honour my subjective experiance and openess from these same books, that / BD speaks. Truely if I read these words and they have meaning in my life, are they too not real?

Lets all bring some compassion, and listen to those who are trying to offer an understanding or a perspective, as we each talk our piece. It seems that most agree that we all have our own valid experiance to share and follow, so live that idea.

Spirtual people and people who feel spiritual are close relatives at least so it would be in all our best interests to understand our cousins, because if all the people who feel connected to life are arguing, then what have we really all accomplished?

Love your brothers and sisters and seek understanding/reconciliation.

Best intention,
Sage

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Bad dog

Ok Im not trying to piss anybody off here I am not saying that you are wrong here about the spirituality of being stoned.

I am merely trying to point out that Yoga, the original stuff from india developed by a handfull of yogi's into different styles, before the west turned into an industry.

All these yogi's are saying the same thing.

Yoga is a step on the way to enlightenment.
Meditation is the ability to make the mind quiet and still which then allows the meditator to do all sorts of crazy shit.
The ming is part of the body, so if the body can't get into the right state then the mind can't either, hence yoga.
You train your body be able to relax. (I'm heavilly simplicising here)

Now part of yoga is looking after the body, keeping it internally clean, hence no meat, no alcohol, no caffience, tabacco or OTHER FORIEGN SUBSTANCES THAT INFLUENCE THE affore said body.

Even the urge for sex must be overcome (if your dick won't be quiet then how can your mind) It involves controlling yourself without control by letting go of things.

So what I am trying to say here is that you can't acheive 100% in yoga / meditation/ spirituallity/ enlightenment by using drugs.

You are supposed to do it all by yourself, without the help / aid of ANYTHING ELSE apart from your own body and mind.

The more serious among you will find that the better you get at something the more you want to achieve the maximum you can. You cannot achieve the maximum in these things when you are stoned. Which was my original point.

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this is where i live

GirlsHateMe

the chinese beg to differ, they were pretty enlightened and they were massive pot heads...

"You cannot achieve the maximum in these things when you are stoned."

I just dont agree with that at all, different pot does different things, who are you to say what can and cannot be done inside ones own mind...

ziplock

Real was a bad choice of words, but in the end... Words are guideposts, signs pointing you in the direction of meaning. Meaning, experience, or understanding, this is ultimately what one is trying to obtain through words. This meaning is not exclusive to a certain set of words or a certain school of thought. The meaning is universal, can be gained from pretty much anything. I want people in touch with the meaning. In that sense, most of the time these words just get in the way.

As for Bondi, his diverse array of assumptions and arbitrary parameters has lost it's luster to me.

__________________
Insanity is the only sane reaction to an insane society.

reverie

Achieving a spiritual state through meditation and yoga sober is a great feat and I truly respect it..very much so. It is a great discipline on many levels of which I believe allows for an individual to grow exponentially so. At the same time I believe it is essential for one to realize that in this life we operate on a linear mode. And by that I mean that since we cant do everything at once, we must learn to wisely compartmentalize ourselves. Which is to say we must learn where to do what and how in accordance to what the circumstance will allow. We also should consider what result we wish to render. If I have a good chunk of time and what to calibrate myself I will choose yoga to do so. However, if I just want to muse on life and I have to tend to house work shortly, I will smoke a joint and have a cerebral adventure.

I personally do yoga to align my physical and mental together to be one cohesive unit. For me yoga is one of the best means to do that specific thing. I smoke pot to give myself a different perspective on things..It really helps me be genuinely objective, more effectively so than yoga.

But hey to each their own right? Thats the whole point I'm trying to relay..is that we do certain things for certain reasons.. and if marijuana doesn't achieve anything for you..don't use that method. We're individuals, we all take to different things. It's important to remember that, rather than knocking someone down for their methods when you truly cant relate to their unique position.

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Elegies and Reveries to No One. Aka: Poetry and shit.

Bad dog

It was a privelige to have had some luster for you to lose.



You are a really cool person . I have been arguing a point about extreme yoga. Extremism may be the problem. Does achieving the state of enlightenment through exremism actualy make your life better?

If it can't be reached without such extreme measures then is really worth attaining. Now we can have this whole argument again about what is extremism.
We all need to try and be more like you, smoking in moderation, yoga in moderation. I need to work on this point of view and maybe start doing some yoga again. Slightly stoned yoga must be better than no yoga at all.

I really don't like this extremist side in myself.

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this is where i live

SageTree

Bad in realation to what? Real is as much a word as word itself. I'm just picking. I understand what you are saying. In a world of illusion what is not just a label to understand. Signs pointing to meaning, is a good way to state it. I like I like.

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reverie

Thank you so much, I genuinely appreciate it a lot. I definitely hear ya, things so often can be easier said than done. I myself really respect the balance of life and the duality of things, so I aim at a middle ground for the most part. The side of any subject that may be extreme certainly has its places, simply because its an aspect of this dynamic experience-life. At the same time I think its always wise to keep in mind that there are other aspects of life just as well.

We all have aspects of ourselves that aren't so beneficial to us (want my list in print or text?) , but the vital point is awareness. That way one thus has the ability to grow from it. You seem to have that, so no worries. So cheers! I'll smoke one to personal growth.

Haha much love.

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Elegies and Reveries to No One. Aka: Poetry and shit.

Waves

Says who?
I would beg to differ. Everything i do stoned i do pretty much just as good. Music for example. Im actually a better guitar player stoned. I drive safer stoned. etc etc.

I dont see why people continue to spread myths like this. I also used to practice lucid dreaming and i found that it was much easier to do when i had smoked prior. if you can lucid dream easier stoned i dont see why meditation would be any different.

All this stuff about weed not being as legitimate or valid as other practices people see as "spiritual" is completely the result of religious belief systems and only affects one as much as one allows it to. Saying you cant reach enlightenment through drugs is, to me, the same as a christian telling me i cannot reach heaven if i smoke pot or do some other behavior that god deems inappropriate.

__________________
On this life that we call home
The years go fast and the days go so slow