Dr. ShinDig

but you see, it IS my place.

this is the world we live in, a world dominated by religious ignorance. These people (the confident religious) run this planet with the leisure fortune that they are the majority, and so they feel their vast numbers make them right and that makes it OK to impose there will upon others.

so you say I did the same thing: I imposed my belief that god does not exist onto this little girl, maybe so, and you are right.. Who is to say that I'm right about my opinion of the existence of god. no one.. I won't come into this topic with the audacity to say that I know I'm right..

however, what I did was offset (a tiny fraction) of what this girl is going to continue to have pounded into her head for the next 7 years. and I can confidently say that the mother of this girl is NOT right, and that alone is reason enough to do what I did. If she's lucky, my comment, in a few years when this girl is old enough to think rationally, may make her think that just maybe all of her beliefs that mommy taught her should be evaluated. That was my reason for doing what I did.

I feel like in this world, where you have the dominant religious stopping at nothing (going door to door, dooping innocent children, etc) to build upon their legion of ignorance, that I an atheist (an extreme minority) need to do my part in off setting this madness.

and hey, when it comes down to it, this girl is going to be raised a Jehovah's witness, a false belief that she may very well base her entire life on.. does this mean nothing to you? She has already had the will of her mother imposed on her.. that's been done and will continue to be done, again I ask, do you really just leave it at that? The innocence of a little girl.. based on a technicality?

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Dr. ShinDig

It's just not that simple. Everyone does have there thing, but should that thing be something that your mom or dad pounded into your head before you were old enough to understand? shouldn't everyone have a chance to have their own thing instead of their parents thing?

I fail to see how the simple ability to reproduce gives a parent the right to dictate to their children a belief that may forever run their lives. It's wrong, and if a mom can drag her kid along door to door to spread the word, then I damn sure find it ok to take 5 seconds to give the little girl a little dose of reality.

and why does everyone act like I shattered this little girls world anyway?

do you really think that what I said is going to have any effect? I can only hope that she will eventually remember the man that told her god is not real and that it makes her think, but to say that I just changed her mind right there in that instance is just stupid.

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SageTree

Was this really your best?

How did you dispell ignorance?

Are there ways you can actively help teach children by adult modeling, as so they can learn and understand the diverse ways the world works?

Suppose this girl heard everyword you said. Where does she go now that she is on an emotional/spirtual island, with no place to turn?

This is what I'm saying man. Teach through action. Showing this little girl a good conversation in which you set out your ideas and listened politly might be a very good lesson and memory to this girl when she thinks ' There sure are alot of nice people that aren't JH '.....the seed was planted.

Your intentions are noble no doubt, but as the Dhammapada says ' Better than a thousand words, is one, which heard and understood, brings understanding.

In kind
Sage

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verklingen

you don't think most sensible kids figure that out when they realize there's no santa clause?

you're a bully man, get over yourself. if you're so concerned about the kids have some faith in them. if you judge her life to be so terrible don't compound it with the trauma of some random dude talking shit about the woman who bore her. really man this shit exhibits a ridiculous lack of compassion on your part, however righteous your motive may have been

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

Center

^Agree.

I believe we live in a world so overpopulated and corrupted at the highest levels that our citizenry is always one step away from turning to anarchy and lawlessness. The only thing preventing this is the law and morality. Law is now completely corrupted. Our rights of soveriegn citizens are effectively gone. The only thing we have left is our morality.

It obvious, through examination of history, that the most practical means of establishing a mass morality is through religous groups. No matter how much you disagree with the beliefs and teachings of a church you cannot ignore the superb ability of them to unity people in belief. These people live, mostly, on solid principles. Hell, the golden rule is found is most all religions. If these are the means that are necessary to keep civilization civilized then so fucking be it.

OP, your a douche.

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"As an organizer I start where the world is, as it is, not as I would like it to be. That we accept the world as it is does not in any sense weaken our desire to change it into what we believe it should be — it is necessary to begin where the world is if we are going to change it to what we think it should be." - Saul Alinsky

Being

man, shindig, you've just proven youself to be an angry asshole in this thread really.

btw, you are obviously unimformed and haven't done research. JW is a branch of Christianity fyi.

your 'best' was a bully move, and hopefully will have no impact on the child.

to say a parent is all wrong and be crude about it in front of that parents child and walk away is ignorant, and you are proving youself to be that way.

someone with a little love, intelligence, and compassion for human being would have talked, discussed, debated and tryed to point out your point of views in the correct manner.

what you did was wrong, had no backing, no intelligence, and no tact. if a child disagrees with a religion, they will have the choice to leave that religion in time.

and finally, if anything, you did the exact opposite of what you wanted to do. you made yourself look wrong and killed any credibility you may have had.

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Sugar420

lets not be hypocrites by bullying shindig.

Dr. ShinDig

I agree with you that we need to keep order in this crazy world we live in, but...

shouldn't a human being be a decent person because it's the right thing to do.. not because god says we have too?

the end result can be good either way, but I think the reasoning has to be spot on as well if real human progress is to be made.

perhaps I was wrong in what I said, it was a spur of the moment thing really. But I really am bothered by the fact that millions of parents around the world do this to their kids.. many many religions, we know for a fact they are not ALL correct, so we also know that many children are being fed lies throughout their upbringing.

perhaps destroying the children's faith in their parents is the wrong way to go about it.. that means that I need to come up with a different method of helping.




@ being.. you posted in this thread like 3 or 4 times and you wait to tell me all of this stuff in your last post until after everyone else. way to jump on the bandwagon man, how cowardly.

I respect the views of everyone here, except beings.

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Being

third post or so in whole thread, so plz, like i said before, do research before talking about things you dont really know about

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Qui-Bong Jinn

You did the right thing, except forcing atheism on the child, or atleast trying to, not cool man. Jehovah's Witness' piss me off!

Psilocychosis

Didn't you do the thing you criticized the lady for? Pounding beliefs works both ways.

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Life gave me lemons, I didn't make no lemonade, threw the fuckin' lemons back and busted out the Cabernet

Sugar420

JWs are not the same as other christians, i think they are a scam because:

a. they have their own bible which is in my opinion a skewed translation

b. they think God's name is Jehovah and that this is an important theological point: when addressing God you should use God's name. oh i see. the creator of the universe is not smart enough to kno when im talking to them unless i get the right name.

c. they have a word they use among themselves to refer to non-JWs : goats. this makes an us/them mindset which is one of the items on the checklist of cult characteristics

d.they deny the divinity of jesus which i disagree with.

Dr. ShinDig

lol, are you half retarded or something?

you know you jumped on the bandwagon and pretty much repeated what others already said, and then spewed some crap about JWs being a part of christianity.

it's all good man, next time a duder like you shows up at my door, I'll just smile and point to the road.

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Being

just do some reading. herb, sage, and me were the first three to denounce how you treated the child. anything but bandwagon. lol, you attempt at denouncing what i say is flawed. and if you would read instead of getting your panties in a bunch, you would notice im not JW.



they are not the same, but they are in the same type of branch. thats all. they are most obviously VERY different from other christians.

i have never heard the term goat, but interesting.

and simply put, humans are fallible, so would not every bible starting from the begining be prone to errors? (mind you im agreeing with you)

and the whole thing about the name shit, i agree. its kindof pointless. jehovah isn't even an exact, true translation of the hebrew word or whatever (YHWH or something like that)

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Sugar420

being please remember what was said about correcting your brothers vision.

what is the source of that quote? if it wasnt chuck norris then i dont know if im really convinced its true. you might also say that aum shinrikyo is a type of buddhism, but it is not.

the bible being prone to errors due to human fallibility is not a valid argument in the case that the bible was intentionally re-written and edited in order to push a particular viewpoint and deceive people. i know its a common theme of athiests and doubters that all bibles have been re-written and edited over and over so that they can be used to frighten and control ppls minds, but this is also mistaken thinking that doesnt apply to the issue here. the fact is that the jewish torah and the new testament are among the most studied documents on earth. so i wont go into the details but the fact is that any real greek and/or hebrew scholar any/everywhere will say the "new world translation" (the JW's bible) is whack.
it is so different from everyone elses reading of the original hebrew and greek that its not a case of errors due to human fallibility. if that were the case they would have corrected their mistakes by now. they dont because it would no longer seem to support their bogus agenda.

the JW's say they are the only true christian church, to be the only true representatives of god, to have the only correct biblical teaching, and to be the only true announcers of jehovah's coming kingdom. if that was true then any prophesy printed in the watchtower magazine would come true right? since the first watchtower in 1879, it has had a history of proclaiming the end of the world on several dates: 1914, 1915, 1918, 1925, 1940’s, 1975. wrong.
do real prophets predict things that dont happen? no, only false prophets do.

im tellin ya: scam.

Being

im not disagreeing with you. trust me, im not a JW, nor do i believe in all of the showmanship, exclusivity, or self-righteousness, or false prophecies, please don't mistake me for someone who is JW, please.

and the humans being fallible, my point was, that even the writers of the first books of god, because they are human, have the ability to have translated gods message and teachings incorrectly. my belief that the bible should not be studied word for word, and should be taken in a larger context (paying attention to the principles, the major messages, the major morals being pointed out, not individual scriptures) and i think that even the messages may be falsely misinterpreted when transcribing or interpreting the bible. i think the most important part of religion or spirituality needs to be your personal attempt to always find better answers, and have a personal dialect with your god to conclude what is truly right


btw, that quote was from wikipedia

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AlteredStateGrl

Have you told the "brother" you're "studying" with all of this? Exactly this?

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*The sweetest kittens have the sharpest claws.*

Being

Well, i moved so i haven't been able to study with one here yet, but i have explained to previous studies what i don't agree with. of course my dialog on 'hooka is going to be a lot harsher than someone im trying to be polite and friendly with.

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AlteredStateGrl

i don't see your quote as "harsh" wording. just straight honesty. so you're saying you'd change or alter your wording when telling him what you stated above?

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*The sweetest kittens have the sharpest claws.*

Being

well, the way i look at it, i want to debate with the person and learn about their thoughts in a calm, civilized way to maximize the knowledge gained.

i have stated i will not become a JW, i do not believe in the end of the world, i do not believe in some of the man-made rituals

do you think if i said it like i said in my previous post i would be able to continue to have a good discussion? I don't, i think it would become harsh, either in defense of themselves, or their religion.

im actually usually a really nice guy, irl. negativity isn't responded to well irl imo

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