let us discuss christianity - Page 6

BibleGuy · 10-25-2009, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiLLeRrrr

No i mean the Adam and Lilith, Lilith. in the beginning of the first genesis God created Adam and Lilith from the Earth, equally. And as Adam did with Eve later on, felt Lilith should lie UNDER him. And since they were created equally she said fuck that and God banished her from the garden of Eden and cursed her, killing 100 of her unborn babies a month.

That book was taken out of the bible, along with like 5 or 6 others.

Yes, I knew who you were referring to. "Screech Owl" is, I think, the same Lilith. Googling Lilith will turn up this Sumerian relief depicting her with owl's feet and flanked by owls which probably has something to do with the "screech owl" translation in the Bible.

What book was taken out that tells the Lilith as Adam's first wife story?

BibleGuy · 10-25-2009, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Miss_MaryJane

Thankyou for this post i hav been dying to read up on others opions specificaly on christianity.My mother-in-law is very over the top in a christian way if u get my drift and we have purposly avoided her for this.Not to be rude and all but christians are the recruters they want everyone to be just like them with their godly selves. but it seems as though christians have been some of the biggest hipocrits around and please comment bak on the subject because i truely belive that and would like to get some feedbak on the subject

Hi MaryJane,

Sage gave you some good stuff there. I'll just add that, if I understand your recruiting mother-in-law's point of view, she is concerned that if you don't believe what she believes and have not received Jesus the way that she has then you are doomed to eternity in Hell. This is pretty standard doctrine. So, as Sage said, she might be expressing heartfelt concern for you, that is, fear for your life.

hijabihippie · 10-26-2009, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BibleGuy

Yes, I knew who you were referring to. "Screech Owl" is, I think, the same Lilith. Googling Lilith will turn up this Sumerian relief depicting her with owl's feet and flanked by owls which probably has something to do with the "screech owl" translation in the Bible.

What book was taken out that tells the Lilith as Adam's first wife
story?

I believe it's called the book of Lilith, but I'm not sure.
"Screech Owl"... possibly a connection to Artemis, goddess of wisdom?

BibleGuy · 10-26-2009, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpankyMcLankey

christians are fucking idiots IMHO. ...

I mean fuck, a couple hundred years ago humans actually thought viruses were evil spirits or something like that. It's not hard for me to believe that those same idiots were the ones spreading christianity.

Gee, Spanky, that's very harsh. I TOTALLY get what your logic cartoon is saying, but their is a difference between being a "fucking idiot" and being powerfully indoctrinated. And the "Prove it" response from the listener is both challenging and emotionally provoking. "Why do you say you have a baseball?" would be much more inviting and non-threatening. Challenging a Christian to "Prove it!" (whatever they may have said) strikes at the core of their being and they may feel directly challenged to defend their best friend, brother, Lord, Saviour and King (Jesus). That is a STRONG challenge to say the least. Sage had some great things to say about love and kindness in this thread that would apply to this situation.

Regarding viruses being evil spirits:
Modern shamans still hold this belief which is not unfounded. Way Of The Shaman by Michael Harner is an excellent and easy read if your interested in understanding such views.

Peace

Mercury · 10-26-2009, 05:14 PM

How does the bible explain early european mythology?

**~~SpankyMcLankey~~** · 10-26-2009, 08:13 PM

I'm just trying to say, most hard core christians I have met hardly have any direction in their life. Usually very socially awkward people, that's all. I've never dug much deeper to find anything else out about them because they are generally un-interesting people to me. Like I said, I'm not directing this at anyone. I could say the same for some hard core catholics, pretty much the same general idea to me. I know they are very different when it comes down to the details, but that's just it, religion shouldn't be about details like praying a certain amount of times for a certain sin, etc.. I've hard a couple friends that were both hard core christian/catholic and we got along great, we just always had to avoid religion in conversations. hahah

Another thing I think about often is how christians generally turn to God in times of need more than any other time. It's like "they" try to use it as an emotional stepping stone. Some of "them" don't even question the bible(or their own beliefs for that matter) at all.

If you have never seen Pen and Tellers Bullshit about the Bible, it's a good one.

I like to think of religion as this clip....

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1l...the-answe_news

hijabihippie · 10-27-2009, 08:28 AM

"More and more people are leaving the church and going back to God."--Lenny Bruce
Spanky, if you think "christians are fucking idiots", may I respectfully suggest you check out the Revs. Martin Luther King, Jr. and Desmond Tutu. Stereotyping is dangerous business.

verklingen · 10-27-2009, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpankyMcLankey

I'm just trying to say, most hard core christians I have met hardly have any direction in their life. Usually very socially awkward people, that's all. I've never dug much deeper to find anything else out about them because they are generally un-interesting people to me. Like I said, I'm not directing this at anyone. I could say the same for some hard core catholics, pretty much the same general idea to me. I know they are very different when it comes down to the details, but that's just it, religion shouldn't be about details like praying a certain amount of times for a certain sin, etc.. I've hard a couple friends that were both hard core christian/catholic and we got along great, we just always had to avoid religion in conversations. hahah

Another thing I think about often is how christians generally turn to God in times of need more than any other time. It's like "they" try to use it as an emotional stepping stone. Some of "them" don't even question the bible(or their own beliefs for that matter) at all.

If you have never seen Pen and Tellers Bullshit about the Bible, it's a good one.

I like to think of religion as this clip....

Dailymotion - The Final Exam-Mormons are the answer - a News & Politics video

it's true: very many people do not question what they grew up with. it's a mentality we all share at one point or another, whether we'd like to admit to it or not. i consider it a natural inclination, selected for generation after generation to foster an allegiance to behaviors which were proven to yield survival. in a very real way the dark ages still reverberate within our society. but our abilities to reason and imagine give us a clearer vantage and allow us greater freedom over our behaviors. one of the results of putting it to use is the technological civilization we enjoy today, and in a way i could argue that all damage done by our technology has at its root the dark age mentality of maintaining the status quo.

anyway, overcoming religion is not the answer to overcoming this affinity of ours. it's a deeper problem that commonly expresses itself through religion, but it's just as likely to be found anjywhere throughout the entire spectrum of human experience

~1~ · 10-27-2009, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hijabihippie

Spanky, if you think "christians are fucking idiots", may I respectfully suggest you check out the Revs. Martin Luther King, Jr. and Desmond Tutu. Stereotyping is dangerous business.

Sure, then check out Billy Graham and Jim Baker and Benny Hinn and...

Alot of zealots are idiots, alot of the rest are just sheep, if the Church of Satan had been first on the list this would be a 'Satanic country'.

Jesse Ventura said it best and it cost him alot to voice an opinion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jesse

Organized religion is a sham and a crutch for weak-minded people who need strength in numbers. It tells people to go out and stick their noses in other people's business.

BibleGuy · 10-27-2009, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury

How does the bible explain early european mythology?

I'm not sure that it does, but there are some comparisons out there that you can google for... I've seen some interesting parallels in Norse Mythology. I personally find symbols very interesting, and the Triquetra, a popular representation of the Trinity in Christianity, appears to stem from the Old Norse Valknut which means "Slain warrior's knot", pictured twice under Odin's horse here:

Triquetra:

These are also related to the Triskele:

It's interesting how these symbols, particularly the Triquetra, appear in various mythologies including pagan/neo-pagan and Wicca to represent various unities of three such as mother, daughter and grandmother; maiden, mother, crone; past, present and future; Father, Son and Holy Spirit in Christianity; mind, body, soul, etc. Personally, I view it in terms of our nature: Mind, Body and Breath = one person - a reflection of our Creator (one, not three, in my opinion).

I know you weren't asking about symbols, specifically, but I find them very interesting and these seem to link various mythologies including and rooted in European mythology.

BibleGuy · 10-27-2009, 10:17 AM

The Gamesters of Triskelion was a cool old Star Trek episode (yeah, I'm a geek).

BibleGuy · 10-27-2009, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verk

(South Park video)

Don't we get to buy a vowel or call a life-line or something?

**SageTree** · 10-27-2009, 11:36 AM

nahnahnah....This is a hardcore christian!

Artista - On Solid Ground
Album - On Solid Ground EP
Website - ON SOLID GROUND (R.I.P) on MySpace Music - Free Streaming MP3s, Pictures & Music Downloads
Genero - Death Metal/Hardcore/Christian
Country - North Carolina, Estados Unidos

Seriously...hardcore man.

Now I'm on the search for hardcore bands of all religions.

I think I know good people and assholes from all walks of life, who proclaim to know it all with or without a creed. Cut us all some slack.

Is part of the problem that you don't know what to say to your Hardcore Christians you meet? What is your intention of talking to them or just not walking away? Is it just annoyance or a subtle fear of not having certainties to say back? What is it that is so bad about talking to another person about their ideas and beliefs? Is it because they seem to not want to hear yours?

I'm just spouting questions on the basis of What is so bad about talking to people you disagree with or disagree with you?

Sage

How about this guy singing hardcore?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbE5HtqU7us

**~~SpankyMcLankey~~** · 10-27-2009, 06:54 PM

If that post was referring to me, note I previously mentioned having two of my closest friends in life so far have been "hardcore religious." Religion doesn't play a big part in my current life, but I would definitely say belief still exists in me whether it's believing in a higher power or even "God." I still have beliefs, I just like to question my own beliefs while discussing it with others. Those "hardcore christians" tend to take the things I say about religion offensively even if that's not how I mean it. I avoid that topic with those "types" of people just to avoid aimless negativity, not because I have some kind of a void with them.

I10HaulR · 10-27-2009, 10:14 PM

I'll pipe in on the Christianity topic.
Christianity is an ideology based on greed. At the time of invention, it was the greed and love of the material things of this world held by the Jews and Romans that lead to the alleged crucification of Jesus.

Now if you read the teachings of Jesus in the bible, and follow them, you are actually following Islam. Never in his teachings in the Bible did he ever mention to worship him.

Now here's Christianity's kickers.

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

John 2:2
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world

Now these two verses are THE very definition of "Christianity" and the philosophy of both of them is what corrupts most of the world today.

John 3:16 gives extreme power to the Roman Church. It should really read, "The gate way to heaven is through Jesus Christ, the son of God, and we just copyrighted him. So your salvation lies with us."

2:2 Is an open invitation to basically do whatever you want to do because, well, Jesus died for YOU and YOUR sins. I want everyone to think really hard about this. That one person, or any multitude of people could bear the burden of anyone else's sins. There's absolutely no logic in this. I know that I'm responsible for my actions, I know that you're responsible for your actions. It's just a truth of the world. The results of this passage can be seen in the ill of todays world. Doing something really horrific is seen as a "oh he's going to hell" sin. But the little sins, the greed, the excess, the adultery, lies, cheating, stealing...well Jesus died for those, so find Jesus and you'll be forgiven. This takes out the fear of God, and after you get away with a few things(in this world) you do a few more and it basically snowballs into the society we have today.

SO, what's so wrong with our society today? I mean it seems fair, right? We're civilized, we have laws that are enforced to protect us. We have free market. We have the constitution so the powers of our nation don't go over bounds(LOL). The greed and the consumption of this nation, and other "western" nations, coupled with debt and the interest applied, is directly responsible for the corruption and oppression of " the rest of the world".
What a burning hell awaits for those who don't fear God, who made this world so it should be as one community. He gave us a manual, all you have to do is follow it, but so few believe.

**~~SpankyMcLankey~~** · 10-27-2009, 10:46 PM

dude, wtf? why can't i think like that? that (lol) made me lol

Sugar420 · 10-27-2009, 11:19 PM

Quote:

Now if you read the teachings of Jesus in the bible, and follow them, you are actually following Islam.

isnt it possible that if you follow Islam and submit yourself to God, then you are actually being a real christian, rather than those fake ppl that claim to be christian? cuz there are so many, they are wolves in sheeps clothing.

Quote:

Never in his teachings in the Bible did he ever mention to worship him.

a lot of people think john 14:6 means that we ought to worship Him.
also He made a lot of I AM statements just as God made to moses back in the day. here is a long list of them that appear in the book of john IAM Bible Verses #14 they also appear in many other books

Quote:

2:2 Is an open invitation to basically do whatever you want to do because, well, Jesus died for YOU and YOUR sins. I want everyone to think really hard about this. That one person, or any multitude of people could bear the burden of anyone else's sins. There's absolutely no logic in this.

this is from a different (old) thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnimalLover420

Well this is how it works out. The very first followers of the Hebrew God were required to make specific sacrifices of blood, grain, incense, etc. to atone for their sins. The animals they chose had to be pure to show that the people had obedience to God and resentment for their wrongs.. Profits as early as 300 B.C. began talking of a messiah and made striking predictions about the death of Christ. Jesus was born free of sin and lived his entire life free of sin and therefore served as the ultimate sacrifice for humankind if we can humble ourselves enough to admit it. That is a very basic version of what I believe to be true, take it or leave it...

i am with you on this.

for the early jews and a lot of other world religions, it was all about making sacrifices to God, basically to stay on God's good side. and that was just the relationship people had with God then becuz even among themselves, morality was measured by "eye for an eye" and every act had to be measured by this kind of "moral accounting"
even today people talk about this kind of moral accounting in money terms: somebody does somthing shitty to you, and its your moral obligation to "pay him back" with some equally shitty treatment, unless you want to "pay him back, with interest"
but if you want somebody to do a good deed for you, you say "ill owe you one"
so people were making sacifices to God all the time to keep this kind of accounting with God

then Jesus turned it around. it was no longer people making sacrifices to God, but God making a sacrifice to us. and all the law about sins and sacrifice and stoning people, and exiling people out of your camp, all of that is finished.
Jesus changed that whole thing: the whole way of thinking about morality and humans relationship to God

so when we say "Jesus died on the cross for our sins" it is another way of saying that Jesus did away with moral accounting by paying our bill once and for all. people dont "owe" sacrifices anymore, and when you brother strikes you, you dont smack him back just as hard or harder, you turn the other cheek.

so this does not mean we can do whatever wickedness we want without consequence. this mean we dont do some bad thing then just wipe it away by sacrificing a few lambs, only God can forgive us our wickedness. God loves us so much that He does forgive us when we repent and come to Him.

this is not to any particular person:
a lot of people claiming to be christian say and do things that may be confusing or appear hypocritical, and ppl may tell us that the bible says this or says that, and means this or that, but really the only truth you can rely on comes from only one place.
so i want to encourage any/everyone to ask God for wisdom and understanding. dont just rely on what i say or others say or what you hear on tv. not even priests, teachers, judges, old guys with long beards or old ladies with hundreds of grandchildren can answer all our questions. only Jah can, so i encourage you to ask Him.

BibleGuy · 10-27-2009, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mercury

How does the bible explain early european mythology?

Mercury,

Are you looking for some kind of explanation regarding biblical references to witchcraft, such as

"Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live." (Exodus 22:18)

?

Metta

420smokeman · 10-29-2009, 02:49 PM

about soma being aminita muscaria.... just found 3 huge ones on my street

ahahaha..

verklingen · 10-29-2009, 03:02 PM

killer!

10-26-2009, 08:13 PM	#106 (permalink)
~~SpankyMcLankey~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,310 Thanks: 1,748 Thanked 1,063 Times in 703 Posts	I'm just trying to say, most hard core christians I have met hardly have any direction in their life. Usually very socially awkward people, that's all. I've never dug much deeper to find anything else out about them because they are generally un-interesting people to me. Like I said, I'm not directing this at anyone. I could say the same for some hard core catholics, pretty much the same general idea to me. I know they are very different when it comes down to the details, but that's just it, religion shouldn't be about details like praying a certain amount of times for a certain sin, etc.. I've hard a couple friends that were both hard core christian/catholic and we got along great, we just always had to avoid religion in conversations. hahah Another thing I think about often is how christians generally turn to God in times of need more than any other time. It's like "they" try to use it as an emotional stepping stone. Some of "them" don't even question the bible(or their own beliefs for that matter) at all. If you have never seen Pen and Tellers Bullshit about the Bible, it's a good one. I like to think of religion as this clip.... http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1l...the-answe_news Last edited by SpankyMcLankey; 10-26-2009 at 08:20 PM.

10-29-2009, 02:49 PM	#119 (permalink)
420smokeman CannabisConnoisseur Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: BC Posts: 1,569 Thanks: 192 Thanked 145 Times in 96 Posts	about soma being aminita muscaria.... just found 3 huge ones on my street ahahaha.. __________________ cause there aint nothing else to do and any where i go i know im you and i keep coming back forward through to myself

10-29-2009, 03:02 PM	#120 (permalink)
verklingen Radical Dreamer Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: texas Posts: 8,031 Thanks: 795 Thanked 1,470 Times in 940 Posts	killer! __________________ “Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.” rip matt

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10-26-2009, 05:14 PM	#105 (permalink)
Mercury Special Delivery Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: The States Posts: 8,190 Thanks: 294 Thanked 799 Times in 537 Posts	How does the bible explain early european mythology?

10-27-2009, 08:28 AM	#107 (permalink)
hijabihippie YaHookan Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,587 Thanks: 1,153 Thanked 655 Times in 515 Posts	"More and more people are leaving the church and going back to God."--Lenny Bruce Spanky, if you think "christians are fucking idiots", may I respectfully suggest you check out the Revs. Martin Luther King, Jr. and Desmond Tutu. Stereotyping is dangerous business.

10-27-2009, 10:17 AM	#111 (permalink)
BibleGuy YaHookan Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 329 Thanks: 137 Thanked 136 Times in 85 Posts	The Gamesters of Triskelion was a cool old Star Trek episode (yeah, I'm a geek).

10-27-2009, 06:54 PM	#114 (permalink)
~~SpankyMcLankey~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,310 Thanks: 1,748 Thanked 1,063 Times in 703 Posts	If that post was referring to me, note I previously mentioned having two of my closest friends in life so far have been "hardcore religious." Religion doesn't play a big part in my current life, but I would definitely say belief still exists in me whether it's believing in a higher power or even "God." I still have beliefs, I just like to question my own beliefs while discussing it with others. Those "hardcore christians" tend to take the things I say about religion offensively even if that's not how I mean it. I avoid that topic with those "types" of people just to avoid aimless negativity, not because I have some kind of a void with them.

10-27-2009, 10:14 PM	#115 (permalink)
I10HaulR YaHookan Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 290 Thanks: 112 Thanked 117 Times in 71 Posts	I'll pipe in on the Christianity topic. Christianity is an ideology based on greed. At the time of invention, it was the greed and love of the material things of this world held by the Jews and Romans that lead to the alleged crucification of Jesus. Now if you read the teachings of Jesus in the bible, and follow them, you are actually following Islam. Never in his teachings in the Bible did he ever mention to worship him. Now here's Christianity's kickers. John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 2:2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world Now these two verses are THE very definition of "Christianity" and the philosophy of both of them is what corrupts most of the world today. John 3:16 gives extreme power to the Roman Church. It should really read, "The gate way to heaven is through Jesus Christ, the son of God, and we just copyrighted him. So your salvation lies with us." 2:2 Is an open invitation to basically do whatever you want to do because, well, Jesus died for YOU and YOUR sins. I want everyone to think really hard about this. That one person, or any multitude of people could bear the burden of anyone else's sins. There's absolutely no logic in this. I know that I'm responsible for my actions, I know that you're responsible for your actions. It's just a truth of the world. The results of this passage can be seen in the ill of todays world. Doing something really horrific is seen as a "oh he's going to hell" sin. But the little sins, the greed, the excess, the adultery, lies, cheating, stealing...well Jesus died for those, so find Jesus and you'll be forgiven. This takes out the fear of God, and after you get away with a few things(in this world) you do a few more and it basically snowballs into the society we have today. SO, what's so wrong with our society today? I mean it seems fair, right? We're civilized, we have laws that are enforced to protect us. We have free market. We have the constitution so the powers of our nation don't go over bounds(LOL). The greed and the consumption of this nation, and other "western" nations, coupled with debt and the interest applied, is directly responsible for the corruption and oppression of " the rest of the world". What a burning hell awaits for those who don't fear God, who made this world so it should be as one community. He gave us a manual, all you have to do is follow it, but so few believe.

10-27-2009, 10:46 PM	#116 (permalink)
~~SpankyMcLankey~~ Banned Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,310 Thanks: 1,748 Thanked 1,063 Times in 703 Posts	dude, wtf? why can't i think like that? that (lol) made me lol

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