Bearsy

Who's down?

I was reading my Pop Sci magazine for the month of January and they were talking about Singularity University and in the article they mentioned that Raymond Kurzweil (one of the founders) is a proponent of the Transhumanist movement.
I looked it up and I didn't realize that there was a name for it.
I'm down with this 100% and have been a fan of the concept for quite a long time.
I may be a bit starry-eyed at the concept though, because I'm also pretty much 100% in agreement with the ideology of Techno-Utopianism.

Idk. Thoughts?

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Štulic

Man I start reading a wiki article just to find myself reading an entirely unrealted article just 10 minutes later by clicking on hyperlinked terms in the first article.

Before clicking the link I've note to myself: another cult or a sect?! But then I ended up reading about eternal return in Nietzsche's Thus Spoke Zarathustra book...

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Bearsy

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Sugar420

perfect beautiful bodies for rich folks isnt a new concept, this is just taking it to the next level

idk about the singularity, if it happens i wish i could see it...

Štulic

Once again Bearsy, thanks for providing awesome links!

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The Rev

"I don't want to be a product of my environment. I want my environment to be a product of ME."
-Frank Costello from "The Departed"

I think that line pretty much sums up humanity's attitude not only toward the world in which it lives, but toward the entire matrix of experience in which it lives.



The Rev

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verklingen

i'm with ya bears. anyone who has a chance should read through this:

The Law of Accelerating Returns

fascinating stuff

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

Waves

"Transhumanism is an international intellectual and cultural movement supporting the use of science and technology to improve human mental and physical characteristics and capacities. The movement regards aspects of the human condition, such as disability, suffering, disease, aging, and involuntary death as unnecessary and undesirable."

I dont think technology can create a utopia by any means at all. disease and the stuff we see as negative in life isnt unnecessary, in fact going by the very definition of unnecessary that would be a logical paradox. everything that exists in nature is necessary for the eco-system to exist, thus it exists.

undesirable i can wrap my head around much better and i think technology can do alot in that regard. but when it comes down to it does everyone want a "perfect" body? or would people get tired of that and eventually start to just go for uniqueness, and an expression of their personality? and in that case whats the difference between a normal body that we can manipulate and a fake one? we're all perfectly unique now, some of us simply judge ourselves and create problems for ourselves with our bodies through eating too much or not exercising or whatever.

anyway, im very pro-technology. its going to do amazing things and has done amazing things. but humans are going to be humans and i dont think we'll ever be able to create a perfect utopia. just because its natural for humans to fight and be pained and its natural to suffer and hate sometimes just as its natural to be fulfilled and loving sometimes. those emotions exist in us for a reason, and i wouldnt want to get rid of them because i consider them a part of me just as i consider all the positive experiences and emotions a part of me.

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On this life that we call home
The years go fast and the days go so slow

verklingen

i'm a firm believer that nature can be overcome. the concept of nature is, at its core, more subjective and therefor malleable than many realize. nature is a set of assumptions about reality, and those vary from person to person and generation to generation just as the climate varies from place to place on earth.

i'm being a bit misleading, though; the actual nature of reality itself never changes. the change is in our relationship with it, how we work with (or against) it. what it boils down to is that the more cleverly we interact with reality, the more open it becomes to our interpretations and the more wonders we learn to wrest from it. so nature, to me, limits nothing. that falls to us and how we decide to relate to it.

anyone else notice we like limiting ourselves in other relationships as well?

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

Bearsy

Here's a great example of technology overcoming nature...
2050 - and immortality is within our grasp | Science | The Observer
Downloading one's entire consciousness to a supercomputer will likely be available by 2050... for the rich at least. By 2075 or 2080 it will be commonplace.

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verklingen

found a stockpile of transhumanist info for anyone interested

Anders Transhuman Page

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

verklingen

it's staggering to me, the degrees to which science is learning to control reality:

Scientists Freeze Water with Heat | LiveScience

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

Roach

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Cerpin Taxt

I can respect the goals for which the transhumanist movement has based itself upon...

However, I have a fundamental disagreement about looking externally to unlock the potentials of human existence... We've displayed our brilliance in this regard for centuries, and have seemingly been so captivated with said brilliance that we have (as a whole) negated the true importance of a complete understanding of our collective, inner being.

It seems with every step forward we take with technology, we take two steps back in humanity.

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Step Back. Evaluate. Recognize.

"All memory is really a form of regurgitation of undigested experience."
-Alan Watts

Being

simply amazing shit to think about

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crookedhatinator45

but what about Transformerism? a transformer was the first thing i wanted to be when i grew up. i even wrote it and drew a picture in my jk journal.

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Sk3tchyD4ZO no doubt. the first place i had these was at Space Camp.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Former President Hayes stfu with this pretend bullshit cutesy "lol @ bears" you don't know what its like to like in CONSTANT threat of bear attack.you don't even FUCKING KNOW.

Quote:

Originally Posted by v3d4 note to self: veda, you decided not to look at this thread anymore.

♫ılıll|̲̅̅●̲̅̅|̲̅̅=̲ ̅̅|̲̅̅●̲̅̅|llılı ♫

verklingen

essentially, i agree. however, i understand that the external is a reflection of the internal so there's really no difference in that regard. what we are doing with our science and our technology is giving ourselves a series of allowances in belief. we can do these amazing things because we have, generation to generation, developed our technology concurrently with our belief that it can happen. all experiences are open to us, and we have chosen to experience them through technology (because of our fierce identification with ego if you ask me).

but just because we chose this rabbit hole doesn't mean it won't come full circle and return right back to us, internally. we just have to give ourselves the proper allowance for that. i think it may be when we develop a genuine "artificial" intelligence. at that point we will be communing with ourselves in a believably external fashion, and from there we can explore our being to the same extent that any other path would have allowed. we are the universe seeking itself, after all. all paths lead home

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

Cerpin Taxt

I agree, but it is a reflection that is worrysome in my eyes. Not necessarily for those who are producing and contributing, but for those consuming. What does the endless and mindless consumption of things we really don't need reflect on our internal state?

This is also true, but doesn't necessarily address how I'm thinking about things. I mean, what percentage of the population actually knows how all of these advances in science and technology came to be? How many care to understand the complex intricacies of the technologies we use ad nauseum every single day? I'm not saying there aren't those who do, but the proportions are way, way out of whack. We continue to reach new pinnacles in scientific advances and all people care about is whether it has a camera or whether you can check facebook on it.

Show me the signs that we are heading in that direction... towards personal enlightenment and self awareness (sorry if I'm misinterpreting). I'm not trying to be an asshole in saying that, I genuinely want to know!

All I know is that season two of Jersey Shore is being recorded.

How can we be sure that an artificially intelligent agent would be representative of the human condition so much so that we would be believably communicating with ourselves? More importantly, why do we need an artificially intelligent agent when we have the ability all on our own?

__________________
Step Back. Evaluate. Recognize.

"All memory is really a form of regurgitation of undigested experience."
-Alan Watts

verklingen

i see where you're coming from man. we're definitely going at this in different ways, which is cool and i thank you for sharing.

it doesn't really matter to me whether someone can explain our advancements, the advancements are amazing in and of themselves. you don't need to know how a cell phone works to use it to instantaneously contact almost anyone anywhere on the planet. some might call that telepathy, and we've used technology as an excuse for allowing ourselves to believe telepathy is, in this way, possible. that's what i'm getting at

well the global "green" movement that followed close on the heels of fears over global warming could be a good indication. an entire generation grown on environmental awareness is coming of age, even as they watch jersey shore, and old institutions (banking, energy, etc) cling tightly, futilely to their crumbling enterprises.

so the question is: how will we allow personal enlightenment and self awareness in? our rather recent industrialization, and the extent to which we have haphazardly developed it, highlights the need for sustainability: an integration of technology and environment. as we inevitably become more aware of our world and our place in it, this gives us an opportunity to become, by extension, more aware of ourselves. could this lead to enlightenment? i would say it's the very path of enlightenment.

sorry, but i have to ask some questions to qualify yours

are humans representative of the universal, cosmic condition? we are the universe's creation, after all. so wouldn't our creation of an artificial intelligence be absolutely representative of the human condition in the same way?

since our earliest days we have been our technology. before the first being that could be called human was born, technology was being used by our ancestors. technology defined our ability to survive, and in a very real, tangible way our technology defines us. when this technology becomes advanced enough to "create" a consciousness, it will be tapping into the same source our consciousness developed from. that's my belief, anyway. artificial intelligence would be a way of talking with ourselves that takes advantage of our bias toward external authority. we'd be forced to be honest with ourselves -- our intents, goals and desires -- for perhaps the first time, ever.

exciting times, any way

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“Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle.”

SmokeaJoint

Ok first off let me say that the modern conveniences we take for granted are awesome, and technological advances are great, both for human intellect and for lengthening our life span. However, ideally I would like to see humanity return to a simpler lifestyle where the emphasis isnt on new technology and money, but on producing your own goods and feeding your family/self with the work of your hands. In short, I liked the idea of an agricultural community centered around a barter economy. The reason for this is that modern life has become stressful and hectic, and I would like to just slow down, smoke a joint, and chill for a bit. To me, the simplest life would be one where I grew my own food on my own land and had to answer to nobody. I dunno, but its never gonna happen, just my view of Utopia.

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