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Old 11-27-2014, 05:51 AM   #21 (permalink)
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Oh man PG, i could break down that link paragraph my paragraph of what's wrong with it.

Here's a few morsels:

Quote:
This elation quickly faded though, when I started to receive criticisms from folks of colour. I received these critiques both online and in school.
Bitch, don't use 'folks of colour' in 2014.

Quote:
n many ways, the most challenging part of this learning process for me was coming to terms with the fact that I don’t actually know what yoga is. I thought I did – I thought it was about healing trauma, getting into my body, but I realized that I had been missing the mark completely. I was missing much bigger picture, where some of the most valuble lessons in yoga come from.
Admit you were teaching something you had no knowledge of FOR TEN YEARS.

Quote:
This same friend used to be part of a teacher training program in Vancouver and was told she needed to teach “our yoga” aka western yoga rather than what she had been taught her whole life. As a result of her refusal to adjust how she teaches she is no longer part of the teaching staff. Can you imagine, a white woman telling someone who has practiced yoga her whole life, that she needs to teach a more Americanized, more white version of a practice that she has practiced her whole life? It’s absurd. This dynamic is exactly why most of us aren’t exposed to any of the philosophical or cultural roots of this practice until we do our teacher training, if we are exposed to this information at all.
She's flat out admitted the Yoga Teacher certification process is ignorant at best.

Quote:
Appropriation is a very difficult and unpopular topic to address in yoga circles. When the wesbite Decolonizing Yoga was launched I was excited, because it meant that perhaps there would be a forum for us to address racism and colonization in the yoga world. And I’m going to be painfully honest here, much to my disappointment I think Decolonizing Yoga has failed to do meaningful decolonizing work. It doesn’t mean that they can’t, but they have a lot of work to do to get there.
How do you think she and the presumably white female creator of this website think people would react to 'decolonizing' in 2014?


Sigh, so much wrong...
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Old 11-27-2014, 06:00 AM   #22 (permalink)
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I like yogurt too! Such a culture....
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Old 11-27-2014, 02:49 PM   #23 (permalink)
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Thanks for the responses, everyone. I've been considering what you all have said.



I just want to add that an interesting part of the discussion-- is the idea that Cultural Appropriation contributes to further alienation, ignorance and lack of education toward the minority group in question, who have often struggled in the face of imperialism for hundreds-- if not thousands of years. For example, rather than looking at the culture from an objective standpoint, the idea is that the trivialization ends up creating a disproportionate acceptance to things that may be historically inaccurate, corrupt or disrespectful to that cultural group's beliefs and rituals.

I'm sure PG can attest, that it's not only the Westernized, white, consumerist group that is guilty of these kind of anthropological mishaps. It happens within said communities as well, Ie: tribe vs tribe. However, Western pop culture is generally accepted as far more pervasive in its influence.

Here is an interesting paper, touching on Cultural appropriation vs. Cultural appreciation
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Old 11-27-2014, 05:38 PM   #24 (permalink)
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the Cultural Police are real busy these dayz.....

it's unbelievable the amount of bs ppl who claim to have knowledge..(all for the money of course)

what happens within to create dysfunction is when ppl introduce 'cultural/traditional practices that are not from here.....or ppl over step their field of understanding.....al ot of the trouble lays within the blood lines from systemic/emotional/physical abuses

Revitalizing culture is not for the light hearted
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Old 11-27-2014, 06:15 PM   #25 (permalink)
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I enjoy to some extent the freedom of the lack of sensation of identifying with a certain culture, in that there is some freedom in knowing that any cultural influence I do choose to adopt in my own behaviors are inescapably an appropriation to some degree.

I can pick and choose ideas, fashions, traditions, what have you, and attribute whatever meaning to them I choose, because there doesn't seem to be any hard and fast rule about how anything must be. Perhaps I can get by in this way because the ways in which I incorporate these influences are minimalistic, since most of my 'traditions' are based on what I see as having fairly well defined logical underpinnings, which help me justify, to myself, the validity of my using them.


That is certainly not to say that I won't listen to the stories behind cultures, I find them at least to be interesting. And I wouldn't do anything to intentionally offend other cultures. But I wouldn't want to allow myself to be restricted by them either, even if certain aspects of my own might be influenced by them.
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Old 11-27-2014, 06:23 PM   #26 (permalink)
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I place no restrictions on the use of my superstitions. Have at it if you want.
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I Just looked up MSF. I that looks like a great cause. Do they have any ties with Doctors without Borders?
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Old 11-27-2014, 06:28 PM   #27 (permalink)
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Excellent. Your culture will adapt to service me. Resistance is futile.
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Old 11-28-2014, 04:19 AM   #28 (permalink)
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I don't see what the problem is here.

I have a culture, you have a culture. When we mix, we create a new culture. Cultures are ever changing.

What's wrong with people finding peace with American style yoga? Is it necessary to know the complete history before doing anything?

What about the martial arts? Pretty much the same, right?
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Old 11-28-2014, 04:46 AM   #29 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by mothernature View Post
Is it necessary to know the complete history before doing anything?
no, absolutely not. but i think one of the main arguments here is that western yoga starts and ends as a business without any thought to explore the history. definitely one of the easiest ways to separate exploiting something vs appreciating it
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Old 11-28-2014, 04:41 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pharm Girl View Post
the Cultural Police are real busy these dayz.....

it's unbelievable the amount of bs ppl who claim to have knowledge..(all for the money of course)

what happens within to create dysfunction is when ppl introduce 'cultural/traditional practices that are not from here.....or ppl over step their field of understanding.....al ot of the trouble lays within the blood lines from systemic/emotional/physical abuses

Revitalizing culture is not for the light hearted
Yeah, no kidding!

May I ask whom is it you speak of that is bringing in other traditions to your land? Those from different localities, or authorities?

Also, is there any sort of general consensus within your community about how to go about revitalizing culture?
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Old 11-28-2014, 05:35 PM   #31 (permalink)
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do what you want to do, dont hurt anyone, and besides that nothing else really matters

including yoga and how its used and why and by whom and in what situations

you want to do yoga for fitness reasons and you dont give a shit about its history? great.

you want to get some great spiritual journey from yoga practice? great.

you want to run a yoga place just to make money and ignore its other uses completely? great.

its all great.

nobodies getting hurt. just offended for dumb reasons. we should all keep doing things that offend other people or groups until they give up and we all become completely impenetrable forces of absolute non-offense.
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Old 11-29-2014, 06:58 AM   #32 (permalink)
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Spoken like a true cultureless white guy.

Some people like where they came from, and not have it corrupted in their face on a daily basis.

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Old 11-29-2014, 09:13 AM   #33 (permalink)
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Spoken like a true cultureless white guy.

Some people like where they came from, and not have it corrupted in their face on a daily basis.

Are there any real consequences? Or still just hurt feelings?
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I Just looked up MSF. I that looks like a great cause. Do they have any ties with Doctors without Borders?
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Old 11-29-2014, 09:29 AM   #34 (permalink)
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It's real when someone else makes money exploiting something they barely know anything about to begin with.

Can you seem to not understand why there are hurt feelings?
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Old 11-29-2014, 10:01 AM   #35 (permalink)
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I'm pretty sure real yogis in India don't care if some soccer moms and hipsters want to pose like them. It does not affect them or their devotion.

The only people that seem to give a shit are people living comfortable first world lives that ran out of actual complaints long ago.


If people in India really don't like white people doing yoga, maybe they should stop playing football and cricket.
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Old 11-29-2014, 01:11 PM   #36 (permalink)
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I'm pretty sure you have no idea what you're talking about, yet you feel like you do.
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Old 11-29-2014, 01:35 PM   #37 (permalink)
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It's real when someone else makes money exploiting something they barely know anything about to begin with.

Can you seem to not understand why there are hurt feelings?

Oh I understand perfectly well why there are hurt feelings, its because in this day and age apparently someone lied to everyone and said if you get real real mad and sad on the internet and bitch enough about being offended you can get gullible idiots to walk on egg shells around you.

Fuck. That.

My belief system gets trashed in my face every day of the year and you know what, I suck it up and try and be nice to people, because bitching about your hurt feeling isnt doing a damn thing to make this place any better to live.(in general, im not yelling at you or anything)

I just don't understand where people got this ridiculous entitlement from.

See quote below.
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Old 11-29-2014, 02:11 PM   #38 (permalink)
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People get offended, and they express their offense. I don't see how that equates to an entitlement. People don't like to see things that they hold sacred trivialized or exploited, and that's understandable. No one here is proposing a law forbidding it, though, unless I missed something.



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Old 11-29-2014, 02:21 PM   #39 (permalink)
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No, some people get on the internet and start stupid movements over being offended over stupid shit.(for example recently, some girl is trying to get a text book changed because it mentions contraceptives and shes a catholic, cry me a river.)

Thats why I said in general and I wasn't trying to get up komps ass specifically. So yeah im thinking you missed a lot of things because some of these people are so damn entitled its gross.
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I was young too, I felt just like you. Hated authority, hated all my bosses, thought they were full of shit. Well it's like they say: If you're not a rebel at the age of twenty, you got no heart. But if you haven't turned establishment by thirty, you got no brains. Because there are no storybook romances. No fairy tale endings. So before you run out to change the world, ask yourself: What do you really want?
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Old 11-29-2014, 03:58 PM   #40 (permalink)
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In this case, the popularity of Yoga clearly indicates that most indians don't really give a shit, but if you ask us our opinions on it yea it sucks.

We simply don't be a part of it and let the skinny white girls talk themselves into spiritual oblivion. At least they'll look good while doing it, though.


Quote:
Originally Posted by CheeseburgerEd
My belief system gets trashed in my face every day of the year and you know what, I suck it up and try and be nice to people, because bitching about your hurt feeling isnt doing a damn thing to make this place any better to live.(in general, im not yelling at you or anything)
You have equal right to bitch. Just if we can all do it politely [aka diplomacy] we can change things for the better of both.
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