Any Christians for Cannabis In Here? - Page 3

Reagan · 06-30-2002, 05:03 PM

[quote]Originally posted by SmoknRidn:
<strong>Soulman, Ive been reading your posts and Ive been impressed with what Ive read. I dont know where I stand on some issues (smoking, getting stoned) but you make very good arguments and references. Youve handled yourself well and I wish more "christians" could act and react the same way you did.</strong><hr></blockquote>

agrred, thanks for the insight soulman

06-30-2002, 06:45 PM

Smoke,
[quote]Youve handled yourself well and I wish more "christians" could act and react the same way you did.<hr></blockquote>
The single biggest complaint I hear around here has to do with how Christians relate to non-Christians. Some of it’s justified, some of it’s not. Some of it’s to be expected (Luke 21:17), but a LOT of it we – as a group – bring on ourselves. I seem to spend most of my time washing other “Christians” dirty laundry.

I try to get along with just about everybody. God love ‘em, Christians can be pretty boring, so I like hanging with sub-culture, Cannabis-oriented back-to-earth types. I don’t have to agree with them on every single issue to enjoy their company, and vice versa. Some beautiful people out there. You respect me, I’ll respect you. Pretty basic. What I don’t like (who would?) is the knee-jerk stereo-typing and the generalizing and the mud-slinging non-Christians engage in before they even get to know someone “pegged” as a Christian. That’s bad.

Here’s my personal credo:

Take one person at a time. Make your own friends, and make your own enemies.

Works for me.

Thanks for engaging.

Soulman

P.S. You a Christian? You toke the smoke? The reason I ask is, as you may have noticed, I’m shaking the bushes looking for other pro-Cannabis, Jesus is Lord types, sorta for mutual consolation and discussion. If not? – peace!

06-30-2002, 06:47 PM

Reagan,

Always a pleasure.

Soulman

06-30-2002, 06:59 PM

I am a Christian who tokes. I don't go to church or anything ; for me its all about the way I treat others and my values agree with Christian values. Its a free country with many types and there is room for all types... later

SmoknRidn · 06-30-2002, 07:02 PM

I have a question for you Soulman. Youve stated your feelings/standings on smoking weed and christianity. And from my understanding, you have no problem with smoking weed as a christian as long as it's not excessive(is this correct?). My question is, if Jesus or anyone else you respect as a christian (moses,john the baptist, any apostle...you know what I mean) were around, would you smoke weed with them there physically. Just curious.

07-01-2002, 11:12 AM

Smoke,
[quote]And from my understanding, you have no problem with smoking weed as a christian as long as it's not excessive (is this correct?).<hr></blockquote>
Yes. As far as I can tell, the moderate use of Cannabis is, Biblically speaking, lawful.
[quote]My question is, if Jesus or anyone else you respect as a christian (moses,john the baptist, any apostle...you know what I mean) were around, would you smoke weed with them there physically. Just curious.<hr></blockquote>
Good question. Jesus is, obviously, a special case. He drank wine, but it’s difficult to imagine Him drinking enough to “howl at the moon.” If Jesus were to tell me that I’m wrong, and I shouldn’t be indulging in Cannabis, I’d take His word for it and stop. If Jesus considered smoking weed lawful, but didn’t smoke Himself, I probably wouldn’t smoke around Him. This might sound a little irreverent, but I think Jesus, as fully God, is already as “stoned” as you can get. But He’s also fully man, so it gets a little complicated. Would (or could) Jesus get a little “drunk”? Hard to imagine that, even though wine is lawful. John the Baptist didn’t drink wine (Luke 7:33), so he probably wouldn’t smoke. As for Moses and the Apostles, I don’t know. Given the legality issue, and given the misinformation and social stigma associated with weed, I wouldn’t be comfortable smoking around most of the “normal” Christians I know. Either pot is lawful (in the Biblical sense) or it’s not. That’s the issue.

Soulman

07-01-2002, 11:23 AM

Bernardo,

You said,
[quote]I am a Christian who tokes. I don't go to church or anything ; for me its all about the way I treat others and my values agree with Christian values. Its a free country with many types and there is room for all types... later.<hr></blockquote>
I agree. But why don’t you go to church? For a Christian, that’s where the “action” is (hearing the Word, the Lord’s Table, Christian fellowship, etc.). I hear what you’re saying, and nothing judgmental here, just wondering.

Soulman

07-01-2002, 11:43 AM

I might end up in Church one of these days

, but I am secure in my life and my faith and knowing that I (most of the time) do the right thing. That is more important to me than anything else, to walk uprightly before God. Later...

SmoknRidn · 07-02-2002, 01:46 AM

Soulman...arent you afraid that your use of pot could hurt your "witness". I mean, dont people have a hard time listening to you when/if they know you use pot.

07-02-2002, 09:30 AM

Smoke,
[quote]Soulman...arent you afraid that your use of pot could hurt your "witness". I mean, dont people have a hard time listening to you when/if they know you use pot.<hr></blockquote>
As far as I know, there’s only one other person in my church who knows I smoke. And he smokes, too. Total strangers don’t know I smoke, people I work with don’t know I smoke. But you make valid point. What if I got busted? You get busted, your name ends up in the newspaper.
[quote]1 Tim 3:7 Moreover he must have a good testimony among those who are outside, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.<hr></blockquote>
As long as pot’s illegal, that (and Rom 13:1) is one of the better reasons not to smoke. My position is even more precarious. I’m a deacon, and I teach at the High School attached to our church. Having admitted that, continuing to smoke, regardless of my personal opinion, seems pretty stupid.

The government’s “War of Drugs” is immoral. Treating drug-users like criminals is immoral. Substance abuse is a moral/spiritual problem, not a “criminal justice” problem. Even if Christians don’t smoke, the “War on Drugs” is evil and should be opposed as a “social justice” issue, just like slavery. We are more likely to be “listened” to if we’re not “users” with a vested interest.

One of the reasons I’ve been spending (too much) time in **YaHooka** is to use it as a sounding board. On Christian boards, the subject is taboo, so there’s no help or feedback there. I can rationalize and make all the pro-Cannabis arguments I want, but it still boils down to why Cannabis is so important to ME. I haven’t quite got that one figured out yet.

Thanks, Smoke.

Soulman

SmoknRidn · 07-02-2002, 12:52 PM

Soulman, thanks for your response...my reason for asking many of those questions is because Im still "searching" for answers. I kinda agree with you on the issue of marijuana not being "wrong" but I still have concerns about using. I dont like to hide stuff and feel somewhat hypocritical if I do. But, I dont want people to lose respect and stop listening to me (talking about christians here) simply because I use. So, I wanted to get someone elses opinion/response to see...and you have helped so I just wanted to say thank you.

SmoknRidn · 07-02-2002, 12:56 PM

One other thing...when I was studying alot, i found that pot helped me get deeper into the scriptures and I felt like i was getting alot more out of it than I ever had before. Maybe this is some of your reasoning???...or it could be just that theres nothing else like some good ole herb!

peon1313 · 07-02-2002, 01:21 PM

Church isn't necessarily where the "action" is for everybody. I find it impossible to reconcile what passes for "a" church today and "the" church in the early days. the church is a body of believers. the ecclesia, or the called out. "A" church is a modern temple. My temple is my body. The kingdom is inside. the ancient church didn't gather somewhere once a week to listen to a father, minister, pastor, reverend or whatever vain title man can come up with preach at them. they more than likely didn't tithe. they didn't have a program. they didn't "go to church". ever. they didn't where their "sunday best" they met at each othres homes for meals and a good time. they talked of God and shared ideas and taught and learned and prayed and ate. when i find "a" church like that, i may go. but until then my God is found among the sinners, lepers and unbelievers right where he was all along. Jesus, anyone? Not locked in a box with stained glass windows. Though technically He's there too.

jc

07-02-2002, 02:01 PM

Some of the best fellowship and conversation I've ever had about the Scriptures, Christ, spiritual growth, etc., has been while under the "influence" of Cannabis. Likewise with studying the Scriptures.

Soulman

07-02-2002, 02:20 PM

Peon,

Lotta that going around these days, and there must be a reason. Not sure I agree about the early Christians not going to church. Many churches are identified at specific locations (Rev 1:4). A tithe, or “collection,” was also taken on the first day of the week (Sunday). The Sunday pattern of worship (Acts 20:7) continued, probably because the Resurrection took place on a Sunday. Some are called to be pastors and teachers, others not (Eph 4:11). Your point is well taken, though. Not sure what the problem is, or why so many Christians feel the way you do.

Peace. And pass the bong.

Soulman

pUNk TOkeEr · 07-02-2002, 11:59 PM

fuck religion

07-03-2002, 12:14 AM

I can certainly identify with where some of the folks on this list are at. I too had a tremendous struggle for many years with the organized church. In fact, I was a believer for 16 years or so before I ever joined one, or became a member that is. Over the period of the last 4 years I've come kicking and screaming into a church, one which has taught me a great deal, albeit one that I wouldn't have pictured myself in 10 years ago.
Part of what really made me search was a gnawing in my gut that told me my "Lone Ranger" approach, the rugged indivdualism that was so charachteristic of western Christianity was hollow. I've come to realize that we are saved togteher. That we all sink or swim together as Christians, as stoners, hell, as human beings.
Some excellent observations on your part Soulman regarding the early church. I believe that the New Testament offers us ample evidence of folks who regularly went to church, had a heirarchal structure and participated in a liturgical worship patterned extensively on Jewish temple worship. I've rambled enough, love this thread!

07-03-2002, 03:12 PM

I'm in C4C. I just joined, encouraged by a couple of guys there.
I'm a Christian, haven't smoked since 1970 and then lit up again in 1999. After going thru some really bad life stuff, I decided that what would it matter now? I needed the stress releaser, relaxer, etc. instead of pills.

It just made more sense since its mostly natural.
I'm married, a Student/Librarian, and love having fun. I have 6 children, and 6 granchillin. Big dysfunctional, sometimes happy family!

I look forward to the discussions,
God bless

07-03-2002, 06:48 PM

Librarian,

Welcome!

I haven’t been in here too long and started this thread in the hopes of engaging other Christians re: Cannabis. You get the occasional “flamer,” but that’s okay, mostly good people asking the right questions.

I tried initiating Cannabis-related discussion on other “Christian” boards, but kept getting locked out, so I wandered in here.

Six kids! (I’ve only got – SEVEN, oldest boy got married last October.)

Lemmie AX you sumthin’…your kids know you smoke? How do you handle that?

Soulman

07-03-2002, 07:00 PM

Mystic,

I think it’s a combination of things. For one thing, it’s an authority problem. Even “Christians” have a hard time submitting, and they hate the idea of being told what to do, or being accountable to anyone. The other thing is bad theology. I never quite know what to say to the Lone Rangers. It just makes me – feel bad. I think they belong in and would benefit from being part of a good local church, but no matter how careful I am, it always comes off sounding “preachy” and judgmental. I understand their reasons, to a point, and mostly sympathize with the bad experiences they’ve had. If you don’t mind me asking, what’s your “theological orientation,” sort to speak? Baptistic, Reformed, Pentecostal, etc.?

Soulman

06-30-2002, 05:03 PM	#41 (permalink)
Reagan Not Dead Yet Join Date: May 2002 Posts: 4,840 Thanks: 0 Thanked 4 Times in 3 Posts	[quote]Originally posted by SmoknRidn: <strong>Soulman, Ive been reading your posts and Ive been impressed with what Ive read. I dont know where I stand on some issues (smoking, getting stoned) but you make very good arguments and references. Youve handled yourself well and I wish more "christians" could act and react the same way you did.</strong><hr></blockquote> agrred, thanks for the insight soulman __________________ "In reggae it is possible to dance and contemplate revolution, anger at oppression, the cruelties of life, the beauty of sexuality, the humour of human existence - all at the same time." Kwame Dawes "Who feels it, knows it..."

06-30-2002, 07:02 PM	#45 (permalink)
SmoknRidn Old School Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 160 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I have a question for you Soulman. Youve stated your feelings/standings on smoking weed and christianity. And from my understanding, you have no problem with smoking weed as a christian as long as it's not excessive(is this correct?). My question is, if Jesus or anyone else you respect as a christian (moses,john the baptist, any apostle...you know what I mean) were around, would you smoke weed with them there physically. Just curious. __________________ Instant, quick grits, new, improved Hurry hurry, rush rush, world on the move Marijuana illegal but ciggarettes cool I might LOOK kinda funny but I ain't no fool Now if you wanna synthesize I emp-athize

07-02-2002, 01:46 AM	#49 (permalink)
SmoknRidn Old School Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 160 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Soulman...arent you afraid that your use of pot could hurt your "witness". I mean, dont people have a hard time listening to you when/if they know you use pot. __________________ Instant, quick grits, new, improved Hurry hurry, rush rush, world on the move Marijuana illegal but ciggarettes cool I might LOOK kinda funny but I ain't no fool Now if you wanna synthesize I emp-athize

07-02-2002, 12:52 PM	#51 (permalink)
SmoknRidn Old School Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 160 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Soulman, thanks for your response...my reason for asking many of those questions is because Im still "searching" for answers. I kinda agree with you on the issue of marijuana not being "wrong" but I still have concerns about using. I dont like to hide stuff and feel somewhat hypocritical if I do. But, I dont want people to lose respect and stop listening to me (talking about christians here) simply because I use. So, I wanted to get someone elses opinion/response to see...and you have helped so I just wanted to say thank you. __________________ Instant, quick grits, new, improved Hurry hurry, rush rush, world on the move Marijuana illegal but ciggarettes cool I might LOOK kinda funny but I ain't no fool Now if you wanna synthesize I emp-athize

07-02-2002, 12:56 PM	#52 (permalink)
SmoknRidn Old School Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 160 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	One other thing...when I was studying alot, i found that pot helped me get deeper into the scriptures and I felt like i was getting alot more out of it than I ever had before. Maybe this is some of your reasoning???...or it could be just that theres nothing else like some good ole herb! __________________ Instant, quick grits, new, improved Hurry hurry, rush rush, world on the move Marijuana illegal but ciggarettes cool I might LOOK kinda funny but I ain't no fool Now if you wanna synthesize I emp-athize

06-30-2002, 06:45 PM	#42 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Smoke, [quote]Youve handled yourself well and I wish more "christians" could act and react the same way you did.<hr></blockquote> The single biggest complaint I hear around here has to do with how Christians relate to non-Christians. Some of it’s justified, some of it’s not. Some of it’s to be expected (Luke 21:17), but a LOT of it we – as a group – bring on ourselves. I seem to spend most of my time washing other “Christians” dirty laundry. I try to get along with just about everybody. God love ‘em, Christians can be pretty boring, so I like hanging with sub-culture, Cannabis-oriented back-to-earth types. I don’t have to agree with them on every single issue to enjoy their company, and vice versa. Some beautiful people out there. You respect me, I’ll respect you. Pretty basic. What I don’t like (who would?) is the knee-jerk stereo-typing and the generalizing and the mud-slinging non-Christians engage in before they even get to know someone “pegged” as a Christian. That’s bad. Here’s my personal credo: Take one person at a time. Make your own friends, and make your own enemies. Works for me. Thanks for engaging. Soulman P.S. You a Christian? You toke the smoke? The reason I ask is, as you may have noticed, I’m shaking the bushes looking for other pro-Cannabis, Jesus is Lord types, sorta for mutual consolation and discussion. If not? – peace!

06-30-2002, 06:47 PM	#43 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Reagan, Always a pleasure. Soulman

06-30-2002, 06:59 PM	#44 (permalink)
_Bernardo_ Guest Posts: n/a	I am a Christian who tokes. I don't go to church or anything ; for me its all about the way I treat others and my values agree with Christian values. Its a free country with many types and there is room for all types... later

07-01-2002, 11:12 AM	#46 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Smoke, [quote]And from my understanding, you have no problem with smoking weed as a christian as long as it's not excessive (is this correct?).<hr></blockquote> Yes. As far as I can tell, the moderate use of Cannabis is, Biblically speaking, lawful. [quote]My question is, if Jesus or anyone else you respect as a christian (moses,john the baptist, any apostle...you know what I mean) were around, would you smoke weed with them there physically. Just curious.<hr></blockquote> Good question. Jesus is, obviously, a special case. He drank wine, but it’s difficult to imagine Him drinking enough to “howl at the moon.” If Jesus were to tell me that I’m wrong, and I shouldn’t be indulging in Cannabis, I’d take His word for it and stop. If Jesus considered smoking weed lawful, but didn’t smoke Himself, I probably wouldn’t smoke around Him. This might sound a little irreverent, but I think Jesus, as fully God, is already as “stoned” as you can get. But He’s also fully man, so it gets a little complicated. Would (or could) Jesus get a little “drunk”? Hard to imagine that, even though wine is lawful. John the Baptist didn’t drink wine (Luke 7:33), so he probably wouldn’t smoke. As for Moses and the Apostles, I don’t know. Given the legality issue, and given the misinformation and social stigma associated with weed, I wouldn’t be comfortable smoking around most of the “normal” Christians I know. Either pot is lawful (in the Biblical sense) or it’s not. That’s the issue. Soulman

07-01-2002, 11:23 AM	#47 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Bernardo, You said, [quote]I am a Christian who tokes. I don't go to church or anything ; for me its all about the way I treat others and my values agree with Christian values. Its a free country with many types and there is room for all types... later.<hr></blockquote> I agree. But why don’t you go to church? For a Christian, that’s where the “action” is (hearing the Word, the Lord’s Table, Christian fellowship, etc.). I hear what you’re saying, and nothing judgmental here, just wondering. Soulman

07-01-2002, 11:43 AM	#48 (permalink)
_Bernardo_ Guest Posts: n/a	I might end up in Church one of these days , but I am secure in my life and my faith and knowing that I (most of the time) do the right thing. That is more important to me than anything else, to walk uprightly before God. Later...

07-02-2002, 09:30 AM	#50 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Smoke, [quote]Soulman...arent you afraid that your use of pot could hurt your "witness". I mean, dont people have a hard time listening to you when/if they know you use pot.<hr></blockquote> As far as I know, there’s only one other person in my church who knows I smoke. And he smokes, too. Total strangers don’t know I smoke, people I work with don’t know I smoke. But you make valid point. What if I got busted? You get busted, your name ends up in the newspaper. [quote]1 Tim 3:7 Moreover he must have a good testimony among those who are outside, lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.<hr></blockquote> As long as pot’s illegal, that (and Rom 13:1) is one of the better reasons not to smoke. My position is even more precarious. I’m a deacon, and I teach at the High School attached to our church. Having admitted that, continuing to smoke, regardless of my personal opinion, seems pretty stupid. The government’s “War of Drugs” is immoral. Treating drug-users like criminals is immoral. Substance abuse is a moral/spiritual problem, not a “criminal justice” problem. Even if Christians don’t smoke, the “War on Drugs” is evil and should be opposed as a “social justice” issue, just like slavery. We are more likely to be “listened” to if we’re not “users” with a vested interest. One of the reasons I’ve been spending (too much) time in YaHooka is to use it as a sounding board. On Christian boards, the subject is taboo, so there’s no help or feedback there. I can rationalize and make all the pro-Cannabis arguments I want, but it still boils down to why Cannabis is so important to ME. I haven’t quite got that one figured out yet. Thanks, Smoke. Soulman

07-02-2002, 01:21 PM	#53 (permalink)
peon1313 Old School Join Date: Feb 2001 Posts: 435 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	Church isn't necessarily where the "action" is for everybody. I find it impossible to reconcile what passes for "a" church today and "the" church in the early days. the church is a body of believers. the ecclesia, or the called out. "A" church is a modern temple. My temple is my body. The kingdom is inside. the ancient church didn't gather somewhere once a week to listen to a father, minister, pastor, reverend or whatever vain title man can come up with preach at them. they more than likely didn't tithe. they didn't have a program. they didn't "go to church". ever. they didn't where their "sunday best" they met at each othres homes for meals and a good time. they talked of God and shared ideas and taught and learned and prayed and ate. when i find "a" church like that, i may go. but until then my God is found among the sinners, lepers and unbelievers right where he was all along. Jesus, anyone? Not locked in a box with stained glass windows. Though technically He's there too. jc __________________ The Universe itself can be called a myth, since bodies and material objects are apparent in it, while souls and intellects are concealed. -- Sallustius

07-02-2002, 02:01 PM	#54 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Some of the best fellowship and conversation I've ever had about the Scriptures, Christ, spiritual growth, etc., has been while under the "influence" of Cannabis. Likewise with studying the Scriptures. Soulman

07-02-2002, 02:20 PM	#55 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Peon, Lotta that going around these days, and there must be a reason. Not sure I agree about the early Christians not going to church. Many churches are identified at specific locations (Rev 1:4). A tithe, or “collection,” was also taken on the first day of the week (Sunday). The Sunday pattern of worship (Acts 20:7) continued, probably because the Resurrection took place on a Sunday. Some are called to be pastors and teachers, others not (Eph 4:11). Your point is well taken, though. Not sure what the problem is, or why so many Christians feel the way you do. Peace. And pass the bong. Soulman

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07-02-2002, 11:59 PM	#56 (permalink)
pUNk TOkeEr Old School Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: juneau, AK Posts: 92 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	fuck religion __________________ "I dont want your revolution i want anarchy and peace"-crass "Fight war Not wars"-crass

07-03-2002, 12:14 AM	#57 (permalink)
mysticwolf Guest Posts: n/a	I can certainly identify with where some of the folks on this list are at. I too had a tremendous struggle for many years with the organized church. In fact, I was a believer for 16 years or so before I ever joined one, or became a member that is. Over the period of the last 4 years I've come kicking and screaming into a church, one which has taught me a great deal, albeit one that I wouldn't have pictured myself in 10 years ago. Part of what really made me search was a gnawing in my gut that told me my "Lone Ranger" approach, the rugged indivdualism that was so charachteristic of western Christianity was hollow. I've come to realize that we are saved togteher. That we all sink or swim together as Christians, as stoners, hell, as human beings. Some excellent observations on your part Soulman regarding the early church. I believe that the New Testament offers us ample evidence of folks who regularly went to church, had a heirarchal structure and participated in a liturgical worship patterned extensively on Jewish temple worship. I've rambled enough, love this thread!

07-03-2002, 03:12 PM	#58 (permalink)
Della Senter Guest Posts: n/a	I'm in C4C. I just joined, encouraged by a couple of guys there. I'm a Christian, haven't smoked since 1970 and then lit up again in 1999. After going thru some really bad life stuff, I decided that what would it matter now? I needed the stress releaser, relaxer, etc. instead of pills. It just made more sense since its mostly natural. I'm married, a Student/Librarian, and love having fun. I have 6 children, and 6 granchillin. Big dysfunctional, sometimes happy family! I look forward to the discussions, God bless

07-03-2002, 06:48 PM	#59 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Librarian, Welcome! I haven’t been in here too long and started this thread in the hopes of engaging other Christians re: Cannabis. You get the occasional “flamer,” but that’s okay, mostly good people asking the right questions. I tried initiating Cannabis-related discussion on other “Christian” boards, but kept getting locked out, so I wandered in here. Six kids! (I’ve only got – SEVEN, oldest boy got married last October.) Lemmie AX you sumthin’…your kids know you smoke? How do you handle that? Soulman

07-03-2002, 07:00 PM	#60 (permalink)
Soulman Guest Posts: n/a	Mystic, I think it’s a combination of things. For one thing, it’s an authority problem. Even “Christians” have a hard time submitting, and they hate the idea of being told what to do, or being accountable to anyone. The other thing is bad theology. I never quite know what to say to the Lone Rangers. It just makes me – feel bad. I think they belong in and would benefit from being part of a good local church, but no matter how careful I am, it always comes off sounding “preachy” and judgmental. I understand their reasons, to a point, and mostly sympathize with the bad experiences they’ve had. If you don’t mind me asking, what’s your “theological orientation,” sort to speak? Baptistic, Reformed, Pentecostal, etc.? Soulman