Religion and kids - Page 3

kamikazi89 · 11-02-2007, 08:47 AM

as the father of a young girl, i think it's important to examine(deconstruct if you will) religious beliefs carefully..

Parallax · 11-02-2007, 12:50 PM

what about something that cant be reversed, like circumcision, is it really right to make that decision for them at such a young age? sure you can teach kids about judaism and take them to the temple or whatever, but maybe the kid doesnt want to be jewish later on, but he's still mutilated for life because of something his parents believe?

kamikazi89 · 11-03-2007, 10:15 AM

lol

Catholic Church sees 'hope' for unbaptized babies

Štulic · 11-10-2007, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Parallax

what about something that cant be reversed, like circumcision, is it really right to make that decision for them at such a young age? sure you can teach kids about judaism and take them to the temple or whatever, but maybe the kid doesnt want to be jewish later on, but he's still mutilated for life because of something his parents believe?

That's bullshit. Circumcision has nothing to do with Judaism or Islam or any other religion.
Circumcision is important for public health and HIV and other VD diseases prevention, it also has many other positive health aspects for the individual like phimosis prevention and personal hygiene.
Also:

Quote:

The American Academy of Pediatrics (1999) stated "a survey of adult males using self-report suggests more varied sexual practice and less sexual dysfunction in circumcised adult men.

kamikazi89 · 11-11-2007, 06:39 AM

WorldNetDaily: Circumcision of 12-year-old sparks holy war for parents

Zooey · 11-11-2007, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Štulic

That's bullshit. Circumcision has nothing to do with Judaism or Islam or any other religion.
Circumcision is important for public health and HIV and other VD diseases prevention, it also has many other positive health aspects for the individual like phimosis prevention and personal hygiene.
Also:

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAP

The American Academy of Pediatrics (1999) stated "a survey of adult males using self-report suggests more varied sexual practice and less sexual dysfunction in circumcised adult men.

Don't talk out of your ass Stulic, and do not take such a subjective quote out of context without at least providing the resource.

Here is American Academy of Pediatrics stance on infant circumcision.

Circumcision Policy Statement -- Task Force on Circumcision 103 (3): 686 -- AAP Policy

Quote:

Originally Posted by AAP

Existing scientific evidence demonstrates potential medical benefits of newborn male circumcision; however, these data are not sufficient to recommend routine neonatal circumcision. In circumstances in which there are potential benefits and risks, yet the procedure is not essential to the child's current well-being, parents should determine what is in the best interest of the child. To make an informed choice, parents of all male infants should be given accurate and unbiased information and be provided the opportunity to discuss this decision. If a decision for circumcision is made, procedural analgesia should be provided.

Although the exact frequency is unknown, it is estimated that 1.2 million newborn males are circumcised in the United States annually at a cost of between $150 and $270 million. This practice has been advocated for reasons that vary from symbolic ritual to preventive health measure. Until the last half century, there has been limited scientific evidence to support or repudiate the routine practice of male circumcision.

Over the past several decades, the American Academy of Pediatrics has published several policy statements on neonatal circumcision of the male infant.1-3 Beginning in its 1971 manual, Standards and Recommendations of Hospital Care of Newborn Infants, and reiterated in the 1975 and 1983 revisions, the Academy concluded that there was no absolute medical indication for routine circumcision.

In 1989, because of new research on circumcision status and urinary tract infection (UTI) and sexually transmitted disease (STD)/acquired immunodeficiency syndrome, the Academy concluded that newborn male circumcision has potential medical benefits and advantages as well as disadvantages and risks.4 This statement also recommended that when circumcision is considered, the benefits and risks should be explained to the parents and informed consent obtained. Subsequently, a number of medical societies in the developed world have published statements that do not recommend routine circumcision of male newborns.5-7 In its position statement, the Australian College of Paediatrics emphasized that in all cases, the medical attendant should avoid exaggeration of either risks or benefits of this procedure.5

Because of the ongoing debate, as well as the publication of new research, it was appropriate to reevaluate the issue of routine neonatal circumcision. This Task Force adopted an evidence-based approach to analyzing the medical literature concerning circumcision. The studies reviewed were obtained through a search of the English language medical literature from 1960 to the present and, additionally, through a search of the bibliographies of the published studies.

As you can see - it is neither FOR or AGAINST the procedure.

Children & Religion - to each their own. All children will form their own views eventually, and its naive to believe that parents will not try to sway their children in their respective direction.
On that note, I'll have to do quite a bit of soul searching if my children end up Conservative Roman Catholic.

**Home Wrecker** · 11-11-2007, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Štulic

That's bullshit. Circumcision has nothing to do with Judaism or Islam or any other religion.
Circumcision is important for public health and HIV and other VD diseases prevention, it also has many other positive health aspects for the individual like phimosis prevention and personal hygiene.
Also:

Circumcision isn't important for public health and isn't a positive thing. There are other effective ways to prevent HIV like wearing condoms and not sleeping with infected people. Having unprotected sex with someone who has HIV is still rolling the dice even if circumcision does help.

An example is Africa and Europe, Africa has a huge amount of HIV cases and circumcision is common while Europe has low HIV rates and circumcision is extremely uncommon. There are a lot of factors in the spreading of HIV and circumcision is near insignificant to the process.

Štulic · 11-17-2007, 04:54 AM

I for one don't miss my foreskin and if my parents didn't make me getting it done while I was a baby, I'd have to get it done later in life when it's much more painful and rememberable.
Why? Because I think that this piece of skin is useless as is the appendix and because I think a circumcision has more benefits then it has downsides.
In fact I'm not aware of ANY downsides at all.

kamikazi89 · 11-17-2007, 09:55 AM

why would you have to? i mean youd really be accustomed to it by then

i doubt it's a choice many many adults make, that's why it's done in infancy..so yo dont know any better

JcP · 11-17-2007, 10:51 AM

to be fair, neither do you.

kamikazi89 · 11-17-2007, 11:01 AM

that's what i keep saying: it's relative(age&consent )

Štulic · 11-17-2007, 11:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamikazi89

why would you have to? i mean youd really be accustomed to it by then

Yes but where I'm from the first chick having the fortune to see my dick would jump up in the air and scream WHAT THE FUCK!?!?!?

msicidron · 11-20-2007, 02:08 PM

cmon now, dont hate on religion. its not all bad, although i think certain things happen when certain religions hit the bigtime. What i think you should do, regardless of what your gf thinks, is wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves. Or just support them if they decide to drop out of the christian religion later in life.

P.S...(lillarry) I once considered myself an atheist, but eventually realized i completely disagree with them and think they are a bunch of self-centered, shallow-minded pricks. One can be spiritual and not religious.

msicidron · 11-20-2007, 02:11 PM

also, regarding circumcision, I feel it is, for lack of a better word, retarded. but maybe it's just me, considering that god made man uncircumsised, so the only possible solution is to mutilate a newborn's genitals.
Damn people suck

srry for the dub post.bongsmilie

Parallax · 11-20-2007, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Štulic

I for one don't miss my foreskin and if my parents didn't make me getting it done while I was a baby, I'd have to get it done later in life when it's much more painful and rememberable.
Why? Because I think that this piece of skin is useless as is the appendix and because I think a circumcision has more benefits then it has downsides.
In fact I'm not aware of ANY downsides at all.

body parts no matter how unnecessary shouldnt be removed unless absolutely necessary. circumcision isnt necessary and should ultimately be up to the person being circumcised and not your parents or rabbi or whatever.

Sugar420 · 11-20-2007, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by msicidron

wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves.

i have heard this over and over about kids and religion.
the thing is, if kids dont learn at a very early age the kind of basic moral teaching that comes from a outlook that rejects violence, materialism and egoism, then you can be sure that the world will teach them to embrace those things in a framework of situational ethics or moral relativism. if you believe
"might makes right" and that unrestricted consumerism is a valid lifestyle choice then i guess thats ok, but to think that anyone turning 18 is suddenly able to make an uninfluenced decision on how they view the world, as long as you dont teach them religion, is naive extreme

Mango · 11-20-2007, 03:40 PM

You can teach a child morals with out teaching them religion and to say otherwise is ignorant.

What parents need to teach there child is how to think for themselves and apply beliefs that work for who they are, not put them in a constraint.

JcP · 11-20-2007, 05:17 PM

circumcision was done for health reasons back in the day.

Nowadays its tradition for some.

Personally, I like being circumcised.

**~~Jake_Armstrong~~** · 11-20-2007, 05:20 PM

I dont believe in religion at all, but I think it's a good idea to be connected with one's community, and in such a religious area as this, church is the place to do it.

JcP · 11-20-2007, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mango

You can teach a child morals with out teaching them religion and to say otherwise is ignorant.

What parents need to teach there child is how to think for themselves and apply beliefs that work for who they are, not put them in a constraint.

morality is religious. Buddhism is a religion without a "God.' What you are passing down is your own personal moral code...the religion of Cloudy.

Nothing wrong with that. Just sayin.

11-02-2007, 08:47 AM	#41 (permalink)
kamikazi89 devils advocate Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,627 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 1,453 Thanked 862 Times in 647 Posts	as the father of a young girl, i think it's important to examine(deconstruct if you will) religious beliefs carefully.. Last edited by kamikazi89; 11-02-2007 at 10:28 AM. Reason: s

11-02-2007, 12:50 PM	#42 (permalink)
Parallax Admiral Join Date: Aug 2003 Posts: 4,739 Thanks: 160 Thanked 590 Times in 318 Posts	what about something that cant be reversed, like circumcision, is it really right to make that decision for them at such a young age? sure you can teach kids about judaism and take them to the temple or whatever, but maybe the kid doesnt want to be jewish later on, but he's still mutilated for life because of something his parents believe? __________________ FUCK THE ROBOTS!!! NUKE THE WHALES!!!

11-20-2007, 02:08 PM	#53 (permalink)
msicidron vibing Join Date: May 2007 Location: North America Posts: 959 Thanks: 229 Thanked 157 Times in 122 Posts	cmon now, dont hate on religion. its not all bad, although i think certain things happen when certain religions hit the bigtime. What i think you should do, regardless of what your gf thinks, is wait till they are old enough to decide for themselves. Or just support them if they decide to drop out of the christian religion later in life. P.S...(lillarry) I once considered myself an atheist, but eventually realized i completely disagree with them and think they are a bunch of self-centered, shallow-minded pricks. One can be spiritual and not religious. __________________ \|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|

11-20-2007, 02:11 PM	#54 (permalink)
msicidron vibing Join Date: May 2007 Location: North America Posts: 959 Thanks: 229 Thanked 157 Times in 122 Posts	also, regarding circumcision, I feel it is, for lack of a better word, retarded. but maybe it's just me, considering that god made man uncircumsised, so the only possible solution is to mutilate a newborn's genitals. Damn people suck srry for the dub post.bongsmilie __________________ \|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|\|

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes	Rate This Thread
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode	Rate This Thread:

11-03-2007, 10:15 AM	#43 (permalink)
kamikazi89 devils advocate Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,627 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 1,453 Thanked 862 Times in 647 Posts	lol Catholic Church sees 'hope' for unbaptized babies

11-11-2007, 06:39 AM	#45 (permalink)
kamikazi89 devils advocate Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 3,627 Blog Entries: 1 Thanks: 1,453 Thanked 862 Times in 647 Posts	WorldNetDaily: Circumcision of 12-year-old sparks holy war for parents

11-20-2007, 05:20 PM	#59 (permalink)
~~Jake_Armstrong~~ Banned Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: elsewhere Posts: 1,115 Thanks: 0 Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts	I dont believe in religion at all, but I think it's a good idea to be connected with one's community, and in such a religious area as this, church is the place to do it.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)