Ego Tripping

Reality is entirely subjective. There is no way I will convey this meaning of this question with words. Those who understand I trust will respond in agreement or at least understanding (as a few have). If someone does not 'get it', I fail to see how its my job to ensure they do? Especially on Philosophy where the foundation is the Unknown?

I'm not trying to be an ass either. You just tend to get accusational and defensive when one fails to convey their question in the exact terms you require to understand it. All I ask is...if you do not 'get it', then open your mind to the possibilites and experiences of other people that you trivialize as 'just your imagination.' This is supposed to be a forum where one goes to expand their mind, not find reasons to close it.

That's all...thanks.

I'm high.

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North_of_Sanity

What I'm getting is:

Basically, even though a Christian realizes that "God", "Satan", "Jesus dying for our sins" etc. may all be silly folklore - They'll never admit it because it "feels right."

I'm not accusing Christians of being wrong in their "religion", just wrong in their "faith" in far-fetched stuff that doesn't exist. Like...does anyone actually think there's a "Promised Land" waiting for people that routinely converse with thin air?

During depressive times in my past, I've tried being Christian and "finding God." But the more I got into it, the more I knew it was just fiction and was a waste of time actully thinking it was going to enlighten my mood. It's just not for me.

I don't hate the fact people like living by the moral standards of religion. Obviously people should have standard "treat others as you wish to be treated" sort of ethics. I just hate people that try to push religion on others as absolute fact and use their "faith" to try and influence people and politics.

You have to admit religion is exploited more than it's used to enlighten people. It's just my personal opinion that all religion is corrupt to the core. Like...how many wars haven't had a religious element to it?

We're going to "fight for God's will"

...then the two parties blow eachothers brains out to determine who's God's dick is longer.


Welcome to planet Earth!

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"His professional diagnosis: Narcissistic Personality Disorder. My unprofessional diagnosis: Nut-Job!" - Jim Rome

"I don't have a girlfriend. But I know a woman who would be upset if she heard me say that." - Mitch Hedberg

"Condoms are stupid" - some dirty ho

snapshot

When something is real enough it's real enough. When someone's conversation with God is real enough for them but not anyone else, it doesn't matter what anyone thinks. This is why I should have no problem with religion.

But I do because DeLay is trying to push for an integration of church and state. When church and state integrate they are no longer classified as church or state in our representative democracy. It turns into an facist theocracy.

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We are all atheists about most of the gods that society has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.
-Richard Dawkins

Ego Tripping

You speak of Religion. I speak of Spirituality. Find the difference and get back to me sometime.

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North_of_Sanity

Whatever floats your boat, man.

If you've convinced yourself you "talk to God" then...I'm happy for you.

Fictional fairy tales just don't work for me.

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"His professional diagnosis: Narcissistic Personality Disorder. My unprofessional diagnosis: Nut-Job!" - Jim Rome

"I don't have a girlfriend. But I know a woman who would be upset if she heard me say that." - Mitch Hedberg

"Condoms are stupid" - some dirty ho

Ego Tripping

Ok......so why are you posting gain?

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SweetSativa

Dang it... how did I miss all of these posts? Look man, if you've convinced yourself that there is no God, that's fine with me... you can be as delusional as you'd like; it has no impact on me. If you are crazy enough to believe that this world is 'random' and 'chance' and there is no creator nor conscious being behind it... hey, good for you dude

I'm sorry, this is in jest (somewhat... ) however I hope that you SEEEEEEE something in the words. I know that I talk to God because he talks back... he sends messengers and signs and has even spoken in true language to me (although he sounded somewhat like a Disney character... you don't think that's a sign of a delusional nature do you :rotflmao: ?)so I know that I have spoken to him. Do I need to convince you? HELL NO... I hope that you just love your life and let me love mine... you're a brother in my eyes regardless of what you believe or do not believe.

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"Why is it that when people talk to God, we call it praying but when God talks to people, we call it crazy?"- Touched by an Angel
http://www.youtube.com/user/immelody.../0/DDRj93dQ0O0

snapshot

Ditto. I'm sure if you'd had a point it's already been explained. If it hasn't then you are looking for proof of God. Good luck finding proof of anything.


I have no idea wtf is going on.

What are your motives NOS.

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We are all atheists about most of the gods that society has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.
-Richard Dawkins

Ego Tripping

I find it no coincidence that the defining human trait of a ...well, a human, is Creativity, we are creative. We have complete Free Will to do so in any way (as well as destruct).

But any dumb animal can destroy something. It takes a truly intelligent mind to act on it's own volition to CREATE something. This means our #1 defining trait is that we organize, plan, build and create.

So if it's true, and we are truly made 'in God's own image', then you can find proof of your maker every thing you do. We are Creative because we are Created. How else would our order, structure and creativity arise from complete chaos without intelligence to guide it?

I suppose this goes back to the Clockmaker's argument. But I find this too convincing personally to be a simple mark of coincidence.

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kiWikkid

Imo, people who seek religion, desire to give away responsibilty of their lives to a supreme being and/or fear death.

People who seek spirituality desire to give meaning to their lives, relieve stress etc, and do it through drugs, music, meditation, or any number of other means.

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THE BLUNCH BLACK OF BLOTRE BLAME

Thepizzaguy

I am the force that binds everthing together. And I'm right at home with it. In my world...

The only times I have to give up the throne is when my mom enters the room, or when I am working. My mom outranks me, at work I become part of the company's world, and my nose turns brown...

Have a great day!

William

Canuck Wisdom

You wanna know what I think the difference is, why you don't understand when I try to explain what I see as talking to God?

Tell me if I'm wrong. But this post ^^, makes me think that to you, God has a defined position.

God to you, is omnipotent (like it is to me), however that makes it SOOOO special, that in order for a little tiny mortal like myself to talk to it, the clouds have to part, a ray of heavenly light strikes me down and a booming voice echos across the land. (overdramatization to prove point). Do you follow? God's not that hard to talk to.

Sometimes the message is more clear then other times though, and the really strong times its very profound and moving.

God probably talks to you all the time, you just either don't listen, or perhaps simply don't acknowledge it as that (which is fine imo and hella more likely then the first).

What is it that's presenting itself as truth?

Anything... truth is one thing and everything. Truth is truth. Not the truth about something, but truth. There is one answer (God) and only one. All things besides that one answer are perversions of truth.

Aspects of it twisted by beings believing their individuals into individual aspects of truth.

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-Knowitall A&P type-

Canuck Wisdom

Personally I think that our society (north america most specifically) is so far gone, so absorbed in individuality and egoism that God is behind all kinds of barriers we've put in front of ourselves. I know I have them and it actually kind of makes me sad...

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-Knowitall A&P type-

Ego Tripping

To get back on track with the topic if possible, I had a nice occurrence today...

As I drove to work I was turning a bend into a bridge that turned towards the sun. The sky was a deep blue already and the trees reflecting the white love back across the land, filtered through the various greens, reds, yellows and purples of the seasonal Wildflowers that are in full bloom. My truck turned more, aligning my entire body with the rays of light extending from the atmosphere. It was warm, peaceful and pierced my entire body like a million little pins of happiness and love. At that moment, a beautiful serenity fell over my consciousness as I realized as I smiled that that I label EVERYTHING I see, and my world is nothing more than my definition of it...it's an extension of myself and how I see it, of how I live and love. For a very brief moment, I stopped looking and observed instead. I saw the world as a reflection of me and all I wanted to do as I faced that gigantic ball of Love was keep driving into it forever.

The warmth slowly receded as the cursed momentum of my Truck took me around the rest of the bend and I left the peace behind me. But I realized that every moment, we leave our houses in some vain attempt to find that same Love I felt for that brief few seconds...and it's all we need to keep us going day to day until we find it again, in some form or another.


This is a typical 'conversation' that I have with God...and while not one word was uttered on either end, I was told more than any book or 'explanation' could provide.

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North_of_Sanity

^^^ That's so gay. I wish I could be that happy.

__________________
"His professional diagnosis: Narcissistic Personality Disorder. My unprofessional diagnosis: Nut-Job!" - Jim Rome

"I don't have a girlfriend. But I know a woman who would be upset if she heard me say that." - Mitch Hedberg

"Condoms are stupid" - some dirty ho

North_of_Sanity

Who said I didn't believe in creation? Obviously something created the code of life. It's just my stance that no one will ever, ever, ever, know the truth of how we were created.

Because people don't know, they just read the Bible and force themselves to believe it in an attempt to give their lives meaning. Sure, it's cute, warm, fuzzy doctrine. But, newsflash, we didn't come from Jesus of Nazareth's spiritual daddy up in the sky. It's the stupidest fucking thing I've ever heard in my life, and millions of people believe it.

"He said 'Let there be light'" Ya, sure

"He returned from Hell to tell ONLY his disciples how terrible it is." Ya, sure

"Noah took one female and one male of every species and took them up onto an arc while a flood passed cleansing the world of evil." Ya, sure

People are so stupid, it totally baffles me. Keep filling that collection plate...

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"His professional diagnosis: Narcissistic Personality Disorder. My unprofessional diagnosis: Nut-Job!" - Jim Rome

"I don't have a girlfriend. But I know a woman who would be upset if she heard me say that." - Mitch Hedberg

"Condoms are stupid" - some dirty ho

funky_unkle

What? Not that it will make the bible more credible to you, but you're way off on the quotes sometimes.

I don't see why it's so irrational to believe that the creator created things by speaking.

Another point I'd like to make is that yes, we can't possibly know anything about the creator and how he did it unless he decides to tell us. The idea of a creator interacting with his creation isn't too far-fetched either, is it? Think about it.

Try not to be too general about believers, and I'll try not to be too general about atheists. I happen to take the bible quite literally (hey, shoot me), but my faith doesn't depend on it. A lot of believers think a lot of it is symbolical or whatever. Some fill the collection plate, some don't.

One could say creation makes a creator probable. A creator makes God probable. Our seemingly innate need to seek God makes a personal God probable. And so on.
By the way, Jesus Himself said "if you don't believe my word, at least believe my works." I don't see too much of a reason to believe what Jesus said if it hadn't been experienced to be true during a couple thousand years.

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A communist officer told a Christian he was beating, "I am almighty, as you suppose your God to be. I can kill you."
The Christian answered, "The power is all on my side. I can love you while you torture me to death."

North_of_Sanity

If you actually believe Jesus of Nazareth was the one born son of the earth's creator, and he died, went to Hell, came back from the dead to tell ONLY his disciples a bunch of stories, then vanished into Heaven once the stories we're complete, then you're stupid.

That's all there is to it. I'm discussing that any further.

__________________
"His professional diagnosis: Narcissistic Personality Disorder. My unprofessional diagnosis: Nut-Job!" - Jim Rome

"I don't have a girlfriend. But I know a woman who would be upset if she heard me say that." - Mitch Hedberg

"Condoms are stupid" - some dirty ho

snapshot

So you do admit that it is a bit irrational or do you wish to rephrase this comment?

Actually I see a lot of hypocracy in your post because you claim you have faith but all through out you beg the question of whether there is a creator or not, admitting that there may not be a creator, yet you still have faith in it.

I just don't understand why you would only accept one option when there are possibly and infinite number of other possibilities. There is nothing close to definitive concerning a higher power yet you've narrowed your choice down to something you put great faith in, the Bible, that you would agree was written by man who were channeling God while writing it. This is why it's stated that the Bible is "the Word of God."

Can you explain to me how you got this faith?

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We are all atheists about most of the gods that society has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further.
-Richard Dawkins

Ego Tripping

I think Jesus was a mushroom personally.

But thats me.

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