Visakha Sutta

Bodhisattva · 03-22-2005, 08:16 AM

I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying in Savatthi at the Eastern Monastery, the palace of Migara's mother. Now at that time a dear and beloved grandson of Visakha, Migara's mother, had died. So Visakha, Migara's mother -- her clothes wet, her hair wet -- went to the Blessed One in the middle of the day and, on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As she was sitting there the Blessed One said to her: "Why have you come here, Visakha -- your clothes wet, your hair wet -- in the middle of the day?"

When this was said, she said to the Blessed One, "My dear and beloved grandson has died. This is why I have come here -- my clothes wet, my hair wet -- in the middle of the day."

"Visakha, would you like to have as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi?"

"Yes, lord, I would like to have as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi."

"But how many people in Savatthi die in the course of a day?"

"Sometimes ten people die in Savatthi in the course of a day, sometimes nine... eight... seven... six... five... four... three... two... Sometimes one person dies in Savatthi in the course of a day. Savatthi is never free from people dying."

"So what do you think, Visakha: Would you ever be free from wet clothes and wet hair?"

"No, lord. Enough of my having as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi."

"Visakha, those who have a hundred dear ones have a hundred sufferings. Those who have ninety dear ones have ninety sufferings. Those who have eighty... seventy... sixty... fifty... forty... thirty... twenty... ten... nine... eight... seven... six... five... four... three... two... Those who have one dear one have one suffering. For those with no dear ones, there are no sufferings. They are free from sorrow, free from stain, free from lamentation, I tell you."

Then, on realizing the significance of that, the Blessed One on that occasion exclaimed:

The sorrows, lamentations,
the many kinds of suffering in the world,
exist dependent on something dear.
They don't exist
when there's nothing dear.
And thus blissful & sorrowless
are those for whom nothing
in the world is dear anywhere.
So one who aspires
to be stainless & sorrowless
shouldn't make anything
in the world dear
anywhere.

SweetSativa · 03-22-2005, 10:15 AM

"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose, nothing aint nothing honey if it aint free and feeling good was easy lord, when he sang the blues... feeling good was good enough for me... good enough for me and my Bobby McGee"

I'll bet that she still holds a place for him in her heart and perhaps she even cherishes his spirit... although a brief moment in time, will leave forever within her heart. Do I dare cut the strings, break the ties... LOOSE THE CHAINS? Only when it is requested and ALWAYS if it is requested but to never hold anything dear... not me, I think. "If you love someone... set them free" . The pain is only there from lack of understanding (from my perspective)... you never lose anyone for you never own anyone... you never lose anything for you never own anything. You love them, hold them dear when they are near you but let them go, give them wings when it is time for them to fly. Easier said than done in this human state plagued by fear, greed, etc.

(good story, btw... I hold everything dear)

Bodhisattva · 03-22-2005, 10:33 AM

[A deva:]

With what is the world tied down?

With the subduing
of what is it freed?
With the abandoning
of what are all bonds
cut through?

[The Buddha:]

With desire the world is tied down.
With the subduing
of desire it's freed.

With the abandoning
of desire all bonds
are cut through.

SweetSativa · 03-22-2005, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bodhisattva

[A deva:]

With what is the world tied down?

With the subduing
of what is it freed?
With the abandoning
of what are all bonds
cut through?

[The Buddha:]

With desire the world is tied down.
With the subduing
of desire it's freed.

With the abandoning
of desire all bonds
are cut through.

I really enjoy these quotes... and the first one fit the day for me. But do we LONG for freedom?

Do we TRY to loose the chains... NO, we simply ARE FREE... we follow our passions but can never lose our dreams.... can never lose anything... only gain experience (this is just basically self-talk of the day)... today is a day filled with desire... of fulfilling (or beginning) to fulfill a dream of mine.... I still look to Yoda as my mentor

"Do or do not do, there is no try." We're created with creator instincts and of free spirit... only of our own accord to we become shackled and chained. Thanks for the inspiration of the day.... perhaps I can now calm my nerves and simply ACT .... so much TRY is just exhausting and accomplishing nothing. lol ... letting go of the desire.... manifesting whatever reality may fall.... loving it all but holding nothing.

Freak--Monster · 03-22-2005, 09:46 PM

I always had the problem with wishing to be free of disire because that is a disire. Quite the paradox. Also, why be blissful and sorrowless when there is no one dear to share that bliss with? How can a man who stands alone be without sorrow?

03-22-2005, 08:16 AM	#1 (permalink)
Bodhisattva Professed Monster Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: The Spectator's Malevolent Neutrality Posts: 328 Thanks: 5 Thanked 18 Times in 12 Posts	Visakha Sutta I have heard that on one occasion the Blessed One was staying in Savatthi at the Eastern Monastery, the palace of Migara's mother. Now at that time a dear and beloved grandson of Visakha, Migara's mother, had died. So Visakha, Migara's mother -- her clothes wet, her hair wet -- went to the Blessed One in the middle of the day and, on arrival, having bowed down to him, sat to one side. As she was sitting there the Blessed One said to her: "Why have you come here, Visakha -- your clothes wet, your hair wet -- in the middle of the day?" When this was said, she said to the Blessed One, "My dear and beloved grandson has died. This is why I have come here -- my clothes wet, my hair wet -- in the middle of the day." "Visakha, would you like to have as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi?" "Yes, lord, I would like to have as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi." "But how many people in Savatthi die in the course of a day?" "Sometimes ten people die in Savatthi in the course of a day, sometimes nine... eight... seven... six... five... four... three... two... Sometimes one person dies in Savatthi in the course of a day. Savatthi is never free from people dying." "So what do you think, Visakha: Would you ever be free from wet clothes and wet hair?" "No, lord. Enough of my having as many children and grandchildren as there are people in Savatthi." "Visakha, those who have a hundred dear ones have a hundred sufferings. Those who have ninety dear ones have ninety sufferings. Those who have eighty... seventy... sixty... fifty... forty... thirty... twenty... ten... nine... eight... seven... six... five... four... three... two... Those who have one dear one have one suffering. For those with no dear ones, there are no sufferings. They are free from sorrow, free from stain, free from lamentation, I tell you." Then, on realizing the significance of that, the Blessed One on that occasion exclaimed: The sorrows, lamentations, the many kinds of suffering in the world, exist dependent on something dear. They don't exist when there's nothing dear. And thus blissful & sorrowless are those for whom nothing in the world is dear anywhere. So one who aspires to be stainless & sorrowless shouldn't make anything in the world dear anywhere. __________________

03-22-2005, 10:15 AM	#2 (permalink)
SweetSativa Lucid Daydreamer Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 3,930 Thanks: 26 Thanked 51 Times in 47 Posts	"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose, nothing aint nothing honey if it aint free and feeling good was easy lord, when he sang the blues... feeling good was good enough for me... good enough for me and my Bobby McGee" I'll bet that she still holds a place for him in her heart and perhaps she even cherishes his spirit... although a brief moment in time, will leave forever within her heart. Do I dare cut the strings, break the ties... LOOSE THE CHAINS? Only when it is requested and ALWAYS if it is requested but to never hold anything dear... not me, I think. "If you love someone... set them free" . The pain is only there from lack of understanding (from my perspective)... you never lose anyone for you never own anyone... you never lose anything for you never own anything. You love them, hold them dear when they are near you but let them go, give them wings when it is time for them to fly. Easier said than done in this human state plagued by fear, greed, etc. (good story, btw... I hold everything dear) __________________ "Why is it that when people talk to God, we call it praying but when God talks to people, we call it crazy?"- Touched by an Angel http://www.youtube.com/user/immelody.../0/DDRj93dQ0O0

03-22-2005, 10:33 AM	#3 (permalink)
Bodhisattva Professed Monster Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: The Spectator's Malevolent Neutrality Posts: 328 Thanks: 5 Thanked 18 Times in 12 Posts	Iccha Sutta [A deva:] With what is the world tied down? With the subduing of what is it freed? With the abandoning of what are all bonds cut through? [The Buddha:] With desire the world is tied down. With the subduing of desire it's freed. With the abandoning of desire all bonds are cut through. __________________

03-22-2005, 09:46 PM	#5 (permalink)
Freak--Monster Gravity's bringin me down Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: A-town Colorado Posts: 33 Thanks: 0 Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts	I always had the problem with wishing to be free of disire because that is a disire. Quite the paradox. Also, why be blissful and sorrowless when there is no one dear to share that bliss with? How can a man who stands alone be without sorrow? __________________ Do what makes you happy...Just don't kill my high

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