all_toked_up

i'm starting a grow which will include 4 to 6 plants and am shopping for a light. i know that hps is prefered for flowering. I also know that they use alot of power and keeping the cost of the electric bill down is a concern. so i was thinking of using a T5 fixture but will a large 4ft 4xx watt fixture use much more electricity than say a 250 watt hps? if the hps wont use much more power and will produce better end product then it's worth it but if the difference is great then i'll probley go with the T5. if anyone can reccomend which kind of light to use it would be a big help

José

you would need a lot of fluorescents to have 4-6 good sized plants. Not worth it IMO. 250w HPS only covers 3'x3' primary and I think 5x5 secondary. Don't ask me the difference, but I assume it just means the buds within the smaller space will be better than the edges of the light window.

I'm pretty sure that 250w HPS has a lot more lumen loss than say something like a 400-600w. 16" away from the bulb is about maximum for good flowers from a 250w. If you just want to grow a personal stash you should just grow like 2 plants with a cfl setup.

AnthonyTaurus

You can definitely use CFLs but the problem is light penetration as the light isn't intense enough to reach the lower part of a tall plant. So you can look into lollipopping which strips the lower branches off so the plant can concentrate its energy into the top portion that receives good light. You can also use LST method which trains the plant like a bonsai tree so that the plants get the most from the light you have. The other idea is to just get more CFLs.

However, I do agree with Spanky. Go for the HPS. I think you're better off. The light spectrum of an HPS is heavy into the orange-red zone.

As far as wattage use, you answered your own question. A 4xx watt CFL fixture uses 4xx watts. If you don't have a problem with 400+ watts, go for 400W hps.

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José

do you mean t-5s? cause you can place CFLS where you can't put tube fluorescents.. for instance, a lamp near the bottom of the plant. other than that I agree with anthony.

AnthonyTaurus

You're right Spanky. I'm just used to treating them the same since they're all flouros. I got used to talking about lights as far as their utility without thinking about the shape. They're called compact and Tx for a reason, right! lol.

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all_toked_up

so i guess i will go with a hps. either a 250 or 400watt. now i just need to find one for a good price that isnt a piece of junk and will burn my house down!

all_toked_up

400 watt HPS GROW LIGHT 400w System Hydroponic sun lamp - eBay (item 120462772924 end time Oct-24-09 10:17:27 PDT)

this light seems like a good deal...any opinoins?

José

none of them will burn your house down, it's you're job to securely hang it. just make sure you have enough room/ventilation to work with the heat that it puts out. If you get a reflector with the ability to put an exhaust on it, do it cause I had to take a masonry grinder to my 250w to put an exhaust in the reflector. It turned out very nice however.

AnthonyTaurus

Exactly as Spanky said. Make sure you have enough space and ventilation. That 400w looks good (edited)

How much space do you have to work with? If it's not a lot then it may make sense to go with a smaller light. This is where fluorescent light may make some sense since they don't put off too much heat. If you think you might have a heat issue, then it may be better that you feel comfortable at night. I've heard too many stories where folks wake up sweating and concerned. Go with the T5s.

And, what are your options for running veg? Can't let you walk out of here running 400w for seedlings lol.

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José

Honestly, I'm guessing 200w of CFL's in a small space put out as much heat as a 250w HPS. I say this because in my opinion I look at CFL's as heating coils. I mean there's air constantly moving through the CFL bulb and so it just heats up the air more efficiently than a single bulb(like an HPS). It's easier to deal with heat when you have only one bulb instead of like 8.

AnthonyTaurus

Nah Spanky. I'm running a 125w CFL now in veg. I also have 5 70w HID - 3 HPS/2 MH - in an array due to my closet dimensions - long and thin. I can grab that CFL barehanded and hold it. It's like holding a cup of tea. But, you know we can't touch that those HIDs at all. Even a regular 60w light bulb will burn your finger tips. Sure, added up, the heat will build with CFLs. But, it will be negligible. Also, with the HIDs you have to factor in the heat from the ballast. The CFLs have built in ballasts. Even then they don't add as much heat. That's really why you can stack up the CFLs so close to the plants. Heat ain't shit with CFLs. LOL

Check these pics borrowed from a thread on ICMag

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José

that is just ludicrous.

edit: It's obviously an experienced grower trying to prove something. Clearly they are not trying to be ergonomically/economically efficient. It is nice to see that it can be done. Thanks for those pics man!

stoneric

Don't skimp. Get an air cooled light. I can put my hands anyplace on my 400watter with discomfort. I paid $450 for it but you can tell the quality is there. I bought cheaper lites over the years and found myself always wanting to upgrade. Start from the top.

Edit: Ooops, I meant NO discomfort.

AnthonyTaurus

You're absolutely right. They are trying to prove something in some cases. The problem is that sometimes you want to try new things. You have people so stuck in their ways and close-minded the first thing they say is "you can't." Fortunately, we growers are some stubborn sumbitches - the reason for bumping heads on new ideas lol. So, when guys set out to prove something, they do it and then gotta rub it in just a little LOL. Now, we're using CFLs and T5s. Same thing with LEDs. The pics up there came from a post about a guy asking about Cold Cathode Flourescent Tubes.

Check it out Can you grow with cold cathode computer lighting? - International Cannagraphic Magazine Forums

Fortunately, there isn't a whole lot of arguing about it. The OP was asking because his friend was already using CCFLs lol.

Hey, all_toked_up. Just to confuse you more about your lighting decisions, you could try out CCFLs too LOL

Also, I kind of agree with Stoneric. It may be worth it to spend the extra because chances are, you'll have those lights for a long time. However, if you just don't have that kind of money or not ready to risk so much early on, then do you what you gotta do.

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all_toked_up

the room is small. it is 4x4'. you think i will have issues with heat? i was thinking of running the ballast outside of the grow room due to space and heat issuses. they make a model of that light that i posted that has a reflector hood that has a vent hole for alittle more so i will prob get it. plus it can run both mh and hps lights. and comes with both bubls too.

as for veg i was planning on running the 400 watt hps. i'v got some seedlings started that are under some small fluorescents right now they are just under cabinet lights i think they are 30 watts and i have 2. should i look into getting something like a 125 watt cfl? would that grow 6 plants in a 4x4 room until they were big enough for the 400watt hps?

thanks to everyone who has replied you guys are being a big help!

stoneric

Right you are Anthony. If one can't afford the expensive lite by all means by the cheaper model. I believe the quality, as far as saftey, is good throughout a wide price range. I'm more settled financially, being an old fuck, so I can afford to pay a little more. The main thing is getting a grow going.

AnthonyTaurus

Great. 4x4 is perfect for 400w. You might be able to fit a few more, get a real SoG or sea of green going lol. How big are the planters or are you going hydro? It might be a good idea to go for square pots if possible. Even if each pot's footprint is about a square foot each, you could squeeze in about 9, I think.

The only problem with using 400w HPS in veg is that it is overkill for the plants and will be murderous on electricity bills. I think you'd be fine with the 30x2 watts of CFL in veg. However, it also depends on how long you plan to veg, how tall you want to let your plants get and so on. I think those 60 watts will do you justice in veg. If anything you can add another 30w bulb. I think you should be gravy with that much light up to about 12" tall before you transition to flower.

Don't sweat the 125w cfl. That's just what I was using from my first grow from start to finish. Now I just use it for veg. The general idea is that you start with low light for seedlings and clones, step it up a bit for veg, and then BLAST the plants with light in flower.

All in all, I think you're good so far.

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all_toked_up

i was planning on using 5 gallon buckets for the pots. i was planning on doin 4 to 6 so i would have alittle room to slip in and tend the crop. i'm thinking about going out and buying a CFL bulb and building my own fixture for a cheap veg light that will be bettet than what i got.

also as far a venting a hps light would it be ok to vent it into my attic? i pan to draw fresh air in from the roof above my attack and connect to one of the already existing attic vents so that nothing looks fishy from outside. as far as a fesh air vent goes what size of ducting would you reccomend? and i would just need to put some kind of fan inline to draw in the air? same for the exhaust what size ducting and carbon filter would be best?