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Old 01-25-2014, 04:20 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Talking about countries

I see statements like "Israel doesn't want peace" or "America will impose sanctions on Iran" and I think there's something really misleading about talking about countries like they do things.

Truth is, the ruling class of America is imposing sanctions on the people who live in Iran, or the ruling class of Israel doesn't want peace. Most of America is people who don't want to be violent, or hurt anyone, and probably wouldn't give a shit if the media, controlled by our ruling class, wasn't being used to convince them otherwise.

The vast, vast majority of people in this world are pretty much the same. We just want to live our lives and be happy, and it's only a very tiny minority that create all this mayhem, all this conflict.



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Old 01-25-2014, 04:47 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Talking about countries, it is fucking great in the EU where you can ride across borders without having your shit searched .
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Old 01-25-2014, 05:39 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Like it or not, the ruling class represents a country on the international stage. Therefore, anything they do is representative of the country.

The average person in Israel might want peace, but they want it on Israeli terms, which doesn't count. And the average American might be neutral on Iran if not pressed, but if you ask, I bet 7/10 advocate war in some capacity.

Even if the media presented nothing but the facts, another country that isn't an ally wanting to protect itself with nukes wouldn't sit well with a lot of people and they would demand the government do something.
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Old 01-25-2014, 06:39 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Doesn't the ruling class owned media convince enough of the vast majority that violence is the answer to make the vast majority no longer the vast majority?
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Old 01-26-2014, 11:19 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadhead94 View Post
Like it or not, the ruling class represents a country on the international stage. Therefore, anything they do is representative of the country.

The average person in Israel might want peace, but they want it on Israeli terms, which doesn't count. And the average American might be neutral on Iran if not pressed, but if you ask, I bet 7/10 advocate war in some capacity.

Even if the media presented nothing but the facts, another country that isn't an ally wanting to protect itself with nukes wouldn't sit well with a lot of people and they would demand the government do something.
Yup, even some hippy-ish, self-described progressives I know are supportive of Obama's foreign policy of drones and attacks as long as they're on a 'smaller scale'. With Americans, the debate isn't whether to go to war, it's when, against who, what kind of invasion...

The flip side to that is Americans are so complacent that our government could go the isolationist route and you'd just get more grumbling from the hillbilly sect and more approval from the civilized people.

There is more wiggle room for government fuckup with complacency. If everyone has their hot pockets and health care, it takes A LOT of bad shit from the government to revolt. In fact it's never happened in the history of the world, because we are the first of it's kind...
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Old 01-26-2014, 11:42 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoK View Post
Yup, even some hippy-ish, self-described progressives I know are supportive of Obama's foreign policy of drones and attacks as long as they're on a 'smaller scale'. With Americans, the debate isn't whether to go to war, it's when, against who, what kind of invasion...

The flip side to that is Americans are so complacent that our government could go the isolationist route and you'd just get more grumbling from the hillbilly sect and more approval from the civilized people.

There is more wiggle room for government fuckup with complacency. If everyone has their hot pockets and health care, it takes A LOT of bad shit from the government to revolt. In fact it's never happened in the history of the world, because we are the first of it's kind...


> mfw he starts talking about hippy-type progressives, hot pockets and healthcare again

> mfw he rants endlessly about societies shortcomings while being a key contributor in what is wrong with society

> dat hypocrisy
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It has zero political or cultural value. It is reactionary in the worse sense: a gnarled wailing of a million broken losers joined in the comradery of hate and petty personal grievance.
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Old 01-26-2014, 12:39 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Rev View Post
I see statements like "Israel doesn't want peace" or "America will impose sanctions on Iran" and I think there's something really misleading about talking about countries like they do things.

Truth is, the ruling class of America is imposing sanctions on the people who live in Iran, or the ruling class of Israel doesn't want peace. Most of America is people who don't want to be violent, or hurt anyone, and probably wouldn't give a shit if the media, controlled by our ruling class, wasn't being used to convince them otherwise.

The vast, vast majority of people in this world are pretty much the same. We just want to live our lives and be happy, and it's only a very tiny minority that create all this mayhem, all this conflict.



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yeah but until the vasty majority of people realize that their governments are inherently evil corrupt thugs who will do anything and everything behind the peoples back that they can to get more money and power for the people in those governments, the governments are going to run all over the people. the people have to realize they are the ones with the power. in america we used to know this, its how we created our country. then we got fat and lazy and forgot. in other countries people are waking up to this, look at the amount of revolutions that have happened in the last decade and its amazing how much people are waking up to this idea that you actually have to push back against government or its going to run amok.

the problem is evil people will take advantage of kind peace loving people because its the nature of evil. and its the nature of good to not fight that. so its a hard stuggle because on one side you have evil fucks going out of their way to be evil and on the other side you have good people who just let evil do its thing out of apathy and not knowing the power is theirs.

like we can all only sit around talking about how much government sucks for so long. that only achieves so much. unless the next step is taken, and that is the people taking action, nothing changes. good has to do more than just be passive. good has to become a pro-active force in the world, and it just hasnt been for so long. even our religious institutions are fucking evil at this point. goodness has been this passive thing that is defined by lack of action taken.

i fully include myself in this catagory of passive assholes who let evil run amok by the way. i need to change as much as everyone else does. or we dont change and become wall-e people.
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Old 01-26-2014, 01:39 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by SoK View Post
Yup, even some hippy-ish, self-described progressives I know are supportive of Obama's foreign policy of drones and attacks
Real hippies would be disgusted with obomba. Progressives are the democrats tea party. Pretending to be different.
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Old 01-28-2014, 07:41 AM   #9 (permalink)
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I think the expression is 'squeaky wheel gets the grease'?
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Old 01-28-2014, 08:19 AM   #10 (permalink)
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I think the expression is 'squeaky wheel gets the grease'?
You should be greasing before the noise starts. That saying is just bad maintenance.
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Old 01-28-2014, 08:21 AM   #11 (permalink)
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^americans are SO literal
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Old 01-28-2014, 09:45 AM   #12 (permalink)
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The vast, vast majority of people in this world are pretty much the same. We just want to live our lives and be happy, and it's only a very tiny minority that create all this mayhem, all this conflict.



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Damn I actually missed this part. Utter nonsense. This is more of that weird belief system you subscribe to about how genetics don't exist and were invented by racist capitalists who were dropped on their head as babies (because otherwise they'd be peace loving doves if they hadn't).
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Old 01-28-2014, 01:21 PM   #13 (permalink)
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I agree with thepremise, but i'm more bothered by how the average person is easily manipulated, and willing to take up arms for the state..and inour society those people are considered above reproach.

also, the USofA was founded by elites who realized they didn't need elites an ocean away, there was never a time when the US wasn't run by elites. just take a look at the Constitution...
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Old 01-29-2014, 09:20 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Death to America!!

In this country 'we' rant & rave about how 'we' are in charge, 'we' elect our officials, (whether thats true or not), its percieved by most of the world that 'we' are at fault for electing a bunch of thugs who are running pretty much slipshod over the rest of the world.

"Americans doing what americans do best, acting unilaterally!"

(that was on 'the Simpsons' once!)
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Old 01-31-2014, 06:04 PM   #15 (permalink)
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you know who i feel bad for? the people of Iraq..i really do. living under a US backed dictator, starved almost to death, invaded and uprooted for no good reason(unless one thinks oil is a good reason} and now living in complete chaos..

we really fucked that up..huge
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Old 01-31-2014, 08:15 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Twice.
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