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Old 11-27-2015, 08:37 AM   #1 (permalink)
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World War I: Through Arab Eyes (Re: Blaming Colonialism)

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Originally Posted by Geeno View Post
Blaming colonialism
I realise this isn't the full context of your quote or question, but I came across this documentary in my Youtube history...
and thought it a bit relevant in this refugee/ME conversation in the other thread.

I didn't want to disrupt in or derail it for a more specific kind of sharing,
so I opened up this one.


It's a three part series at 45:00 a piece.
If you only watch 1 of them, I'd suggest the 3rd one,
as it talk about outcomes of the whole affair, and looks into the Sykes-Picot agreement,
the Balfour Declaration and how subsequent non-sectarian protests were handled by the Colonial powers.









I believe you'l find this Arab-centric perspective also being honest about some of the self-interests of the Arab people,
and others in the region.



As a complete aside:

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Old 11-27-2015, 11:16 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I will cut to the chase.

Firstly it is true that we 'fell onto the backs of the Arabs' and have been hitting them with sticks since then.

Secondly no matter how lame the excuse sounds today, there is only one people to blame for this and that is the Germans.
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God I hate being on bondi's side

Video meliora probeque deteriora sequor.
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Old 11-28-2015, 01:11 PM   #3 (permalink)
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This look at history from a non-white, non-western, non-colonial perspective is the kind of constructivism
and the kind of deconstructing of cultural narratives that is mentioned in the feminism discussion.
Yep
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Old 11-28-2015, 09:59 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondi Bad Dog View Post
I will cut to the chase.

Firstly it is true that we 'fell onto the backs of the Arabs' and have been hitting them with sticks since then.

Secondly no matter how lame the excuse sounds today, there is only one people to blame for this and that is the Germans.
are you saying the germans because they ignited zionism? or starting ww2 in general? the english, french, americans, jews all share a bit too. as well as subsequently the inhabitants of the entire region. it's important to understand how historical trends have played out, and how they should inform our actions going forward. it's also important to remember that everyone has agency, anyone could have acted differently than they did, despite their motivations, and we can break the chain at any time. an example of "co-existent truths" to use sage's term.
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Old 11-29-2015, 10:39 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Go back: Sykes–Picot Agreement

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sykes%...icot_Agreement

Division where-by all arabs were at each others throats, preventing any from gaining enough power to pose any threat. No german input here. Mainly brits & frogs.

Not so much colonialism as controling 'arabia' and, ultimately, oil.

-c-
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:05 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Xil View Post
are you saying the germans because they ignited zionism? or starting ww2 in general? the english, french, americans, jews all share a bit too. as well as subsequently the inhabitants of the entire region. it's important to understand how historical trends have played out, and how they should inform our actions going forward. it's also important to remember that everyone has agency, anyone could have acted differently than they did, despite their motivations, and we can break the chain at any time. an example of "co-existent truths" to use sage's term.
It is hard for you to understand the sheer power of the holocaust that still effects young people today.

It had a scarring effect on the Jewish people. We know what it is to live outside of humanity and have a different view of humanity than anyone else.

It was the Germans who made us like this. We were their victims of an industrial scale genocide carried out with robotic efficiency.

You HAVE to take this into account when dealing with the Jewish people.
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God I hate being on bondi's side

Video meliora probeque deteriora sequor.
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Old 11-29-2015, 09:28 PM   #7 (permalink)
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lol @ playing the victim card almost 100 years later
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Old 11-30-2015, 02:18 AM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
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lol @ playing the victim card almost 100 years later
More like 'still playing the victim card' for 2000 years ALREADY!

Balfour was a weak attempt by the British to placate the Jews (who's money had become essential in order to fight WWI) without at the same time offending the Arabs (who's oil would be needed in the near future).

Sykes-Picot was just Britain and France dividing the region into 'spheres of influence' - read new colonies by a different name, after the Ottoman rule (of over 400 years) collapsed.

Here the British gave a royal fucking to the Arabs to whom they had promised control. Feisal felt so betrayed by Lawrence and his 'British masters' that he wouldn't talk to him again.
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sometimes you just gotta agree with bondi.
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There is no political correctness in FFA
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It's probably just you. Marijuana users tend to be mentally ill and the THC just exacerbates their shortcomings as human beings. You can't believe anything a pot-head says, they're all incompetent and unreliable, not to mention liars and murders.
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God I hate being on bondi's side

Video meliora probeque deteriora sequor.
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Old 11-30-2015, 02:42 AM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bondi Bad Dog View Post
It is hard for you to understand the sheer power of the holocaust that still effects young people today.

It had a scarring effect on the Jewish people. We know what it is to live outside of humanity and have a different view of humanity than anyone else.

It was the Germans who made us like this. We were their victims of an industrial scale genocide carried out with robotic efficiency.

You HAVE to take this into account when dealing with the Jewish people.
You make it sound as though it's a Jewish trait. YOU don't know what it's like to live outside of humanity any more than anyone else.
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Old 11-30-2015, 03:37 AM   #10 (permalink)
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You make it sound as though it's a Jewish trait. YOU don't know what it's like to live outside of humanity any more than anyone else.
You are right, I don't know, personally. However I do know a lot of survivors and children of survivors too know that they were extremely effected by it and there are many of them.

The thing about the holocaust was the sheer inhumanity of it. People were exterminated like cockroaches, there was no emotion in it for most of the Nazi's. It was just a mechanical act of mass extermination, that is the hardest thing to understand and that is what still makes it the worst atrocity in human history and yes it was my people who suffered it.

None of that makes it right what we do or justifies our terrible behavior to the Arabs but it does make it easier for you to understand why we are like that, it has to count as a mitigating circumstance.
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It's probably just you. Marijuana users tend to be mentally ill and the THC just exacerbates their shortcomings as human beings. You can't believe anything a pot-head says, they're all incompetent and unreliable, not to mention liars and murders.
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God I hate being on bondi's side

Video meliora probeque deteriora sequor.
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Old 11-30-2015, 08:28 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Bondi Bad Dog View Post
You are right, I don't know, personally. However I do know a lot of survivors and children of survivors too know that they were extremely effected by it and there are many of them.

The thing about the holocaust was the sheer inhumanity of it. People were exterminated like cockroaches, there was no emotion in it for most of the Nazi's. It was just a mechanical act of mass extermination, that is the hardest thing to understand and that is what still makes it the worst atrocity in human history and yes it was my people who suffered it.

None of that makes it right what we do or justifies our terrible behavior to the Arabs but it does make it easier for you to understand why we are like that, it has to count as a mitigating circumstance.

My problem is how I must be constantly reminded of the sheer inhumanity of it as if I can't comprehend it or I might somehow forget.

The mitigating circumstances reason is used for every conceivable situation imaginable as you pointed out regarding your treatment of Arabs.
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Old 11-30-2015, 09:32 AM   #12 (permalink)
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It is hard for you to understand the sheer power of the holocaust that still effects young people today.

It had a scarring effect on the Jewish people. We know what it is to live outside of humanity and have a different view of humanity than anyone else.

It was the Germans who made us like this. We were their victims of an industrial scale genocide carried out with robotic efficiency.

You HAVE to take this into account when dealing with the Jewish people.
MUH SIX GORRILLION NEVER FORGET OY VEY IT'S ANUDDAH SHOA.

I hate Muslims, but god damn do I fucking hate Jews.
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Old 11-30-2015, 12:56 PM   #13 (permalink)
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MUH SIX GORRILLION NEVER FORGET OY VEY IT'S ANUDDAH SHOA.

I hate Muslims, but god damn do I fucking hate Jews.
let the hate go my man, go see sage for some hugs.
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It's probably just you. Marijuana users tend to be mentally ill and the THC just exacerbates their shortcomings as human beings. You can't believe anything a pot-head says, they're all incompetent and unreliable, not to mention liars and murders.
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God I hate being on bondi's side

Video meliora probeque deteriora sequor.
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Old 11-30-2015, 01:40 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Old 11-30-2015, 01:46 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Old 11-30-2015, 05:03 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Xil, "Free agency".... I like it, man. Good term.



Bondi,

I appreciate some of the things you've said and how you explained the different terms under which the eastern mediterranean has been shaped.

Personally I don't not neglect the far reaching effects of the Holocaust the Jewish People.

But I can't neglect the that I don't see a kind of genocide in what the Arab people have and do experience, at the hands of all sorts of things, and will add that I'm not just including Jews/Israel in the hands effecting Arabs.

And in that I also see why there is also a part of the population that is lashing out in astonishingly violent ways.



I hope that some folks have decided to catch an episode of two of the show I posted.
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Old 11-30-2015, 08:31 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Give me my foreskin back and I'll consider it Chaim.
dude, who took away your foreskin?
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It's probably just you. Marijuana users tend to be mentally ill and the THC just exacerbates their shortcomings as human beings. You can't believe anything a pot-head says, they're all incompetent and unreliable, not to mention liars and murders.
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Old 12-01-2015, 09:14 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
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MUH SIX GORRILLION NEVER FORGET OY VEY IT'S ANUDDAH SHOA.

I hate Muslims, but god damn do I fucking hate Jews.
Is it the peoples, or their beliefs?

(And I thought I was a hateful, spiteful, a-hole sometimes)

-c-

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Old 12-02-2015, 08:12 AM   #19 (permalink)
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I was just trolling Bondi.

But both religions are stupid and stone-age tier tbh(to be honest) fam.

But I generally judge the person not the religion. I've met more Muslims than (practicing) Jews, and by and large the Muslims were chill. I lived in a dorm with Yemenese and Turk dudes. They were the only ones doing summer school besides me. The Yemenbros were really pious and went to Mosque five times a day, but were fun to talk to and I tutored a couple for their lit. classes (they paid me for it too, even when I said don't worry about it).

Turkbros never went to mosque and we smoked gravity-bong bowls in my room. Then we played vidya and I played FIFA for the first time. It was pretty fun.
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Old 12-02-2015, 08:52 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Whew! (<- #19 above)

On another note, I watched a flick last night "The Water Diviner" starring & directed by Russel Crowe. (post here 'cause its somewhat relevant) Time is after, & flashbacks to WWI.
Viewpoint is mainly from the turkish towards Anzac and greeks. Premise of the flick is a bit far-fetched, but has good insight of parties involved. A good one to watch.

-c-
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