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Old 04-03-2016, 04:41 AM   #1 (permalink)
Al Talib
 
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Is violence the Answer? / What is Peace?

"I am living in that Life and Power that takes away all occasion for Wars"
- George Fox, Statement made to Commonwealth Commissioners 1651





I subscribe to the Quakerspeak Youtube channel, and this came across my way,
the other day. It really addressed something that was on my mind at that time,
as well as being a thought/question I ponder regularly.

"What is an expansive meaning to"Pacifism & What is Peace?"


So I start this thread, in an effort to discuss and in hope,
of doing the very thing I perceive the answer to the question to be.





I'll lay some groundwork and background, by which we might speak,
and that you might know a bit of where I'm coming from on the topic...
That is, influences and inspires my thinking, as well as language I connect with.

This is by no means meant to be a solely religious or spiritual conversation.
Bring what guides you to the table of discussion.
Basically, for those who haven't/won't watch the video, but wish to be in the conversation, I find the, again, the words of George Fox useful:

"Be patterns, be examples in all countries, places, islands, nations wherever you come; that your carriage and life may preach among all sorts of people, and to them; then you will come to walk cheerfully over the world, answering that of God in everyone; whereby in them you may be a blessing, and make the witness of God in them to bless you."
-Statement of 1656

George Fox is the man who was called to state the Religious Society of Friends,
who are now more commonly known as Quakers.


Fox, at the time certainly meant God, but today when Quakers Speak of the Divine,
the more liberal folks of the movement would call it "Inner Light",
which is the inherent Goodness in each person, that can be known.

That is what starts to lay the groundwork for Pacifism, as it were.
Like the Buddhists might also add, that there is a common thread of Goodness,
in each of us. And to not honour that or to kill it in one, is to wither it in all of us.

A video if you'd rather:
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Old 04-03-2016, 03:24 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I do not believe pacifism is simply being opposed to war (or that it only about war), or refusing to fight.
I understand why the person in the first video sort of bucks the title 'pacifist'

And feel that there is proactivity involved in 'not fighting',
which is said up the page, about changing conditions so that it needn't arise
(or not as quickly, realistically
I do not believe peace is the merely absence of war or conflict.
I feel that it's also about something more inwardly,
and stems from moving past our conditioned solutions.

And I feel that peace just doesn't happen.... although it's arising is a natural thing.
I do not believe that that any of the above opinions means that I do not support
this men and women who enter into armed conflict.
But I do support a different use/strategy for our military & Defence Dept.


If you have any thoughts I'd love to carry on the conversation.
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Old 04-04-2016, 02:43 AM   #3 (permalink)
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I really like the idea of having a peaceful solution being the gut reaction to a conflict. I'm tired of this 'might makes right' attitude. It is bullying at it's finest.
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Old 04-04-2016, 09:45 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I dig it sage.

(But im one of the people who didn't watch the vids. Sorry lol)

I like the idea of cultivating the good in yourself, so that like mothernature said, your initial reactions to situations start coming from that goodness in you.

And like you said, thus cultivating the conditions for peace and love in the outside world as well.
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Old 04-04-2016, 05:09 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Not quantum leap if anyone has guessed I made this thread to juxtapose some other threads currently charting.

I also made this because we imagine not having to war for peace.... And I wondered if we could take the talk deeper, discuss what peace looks like and perhaps even how to wage it, you could say.... Something more proactive and definitive that just naming the idea.
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Old 04-04-2016, 05:31 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Older article, but relevant in that this Depts creation has been introduced every year since 2001, before the towers were even brought down.

Give ( the department of ) Peace Chance
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Old 04-05-2016, 06:08 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Dept of peace sounds super doublespeaky and evil.
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:16 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Until they free the god damned animals from their concrete wall hells! DAMN THEM! DAMN THEM!
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Old 04-05-2016, 07:16 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Also I watched the videos.


I really don't care at all for the jesus stuff, but I'm happy to support non-violent solutions to problems. As long as they are also good solutions of course..
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Old 04-06-2016, 02:08 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kitch View Post
Dept of peace sounds super doublespeaky and evil.
Yeah.... But bet if you read about it....
Its not like the Ministry of Love, m8
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Old 04-06-2016, 02:10 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir-Ex View Post
Also I watched the videos.


I really don't care at all for the jesus stuff, but I'm happy to support non-violent solutions to problems. As long as they are also good solutions of course..
Quakers are pretty easy going about one's source of power and inspiration... So long as it brings one to a positive ends.... Jesus just happened to be hers. I know a lot of hyphenated Quakers who draw from various tradition. Good folks as folks go.
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Old 04-08-2016, 04:23 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Old 04-08-2016, 07:47 AM   #13 (permalink)
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The peaceful resolution of any issue is always prefered, but, with people with hardcore fundemental beliefs (I'm not targeting religion here), agressive, violent reaction is the only thing they will ever react to/understand.

(imo) -c-
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Old 04-08-2016, 08:03 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cornemuse View Post
The peaceful resolution of any issue is always prefered, but, with people with hardcore fundemental beliefs (I'm not targeting religion here), agressive, violent reaction is the only thing they will ever react to/understand.

(imo) -c-

The US govt and people aren't excluded from the equation, right?
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Old 04-08-2016, 12:55 PM   #15 (permalink)
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We only kill those who deserve to die. Haven't you read the press clippings?
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Old 04-08-2016, 02:06 PM   #16 (permalink)
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Old 04-08-2016, 03:31 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Personally to me peace is internal contentment, you have no jealousy, envy, hatred, no greed, no power lust, you are satisfied with yourself in relation to others, satisfied with your environment, you are in harmony with yourself and everything and everyone around you.... the problem is, what will it take to bring others to this plane?
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Old 04-09-2016, 07:31 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
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We only kill those who deserve to die. Haven't you read the press clippings?
Problem is we kill the ones who mostly dont deserve to die.

-c-
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Old 04-09-2016, 07:33 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cornemuse View Post
The peaceful resolution of any issue is always prefered, but, with people with hardcore fundemental beliefs (I'm not targeting religion here), agressive, violent reaction is the only thing they will ever react to/understand.

(imo) -c-

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sage Tree View Post
The US govt and people aren't excluded from the equation, right?


Same question
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Old 04-09-2016, 08:47 AM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cornemuse View Post
Problem is we kill the ones who mostly dont deserve to die.

-c-
I was being sarcastic. Based on my previous comments about our terrorist actions around the globe, I thought that was obvious.
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