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Old 07-12-2016, 01:16 AM   #121 (permalink)
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racism is defined as "the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics or abilities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

prejudice, discrimination, or antagonism directed against someone of a different race based on the belief that one's own race is superior."

Geeno would have us believe in a violent behavior gene that's somehow tied with black people.

I never said there was zero differences between different groups. I said skin color was an arbitrary way of dividing groups.

In your own example Xil, both groups of muscle twitchers are presumably black.

And as far as I know, scientists have grouped us as homo sapiens. Human beings. One race. The human race.
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Old 07-12-2016, 04:50 AM   #122 (permalink)
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monoamine_oxidase_A

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24326626
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Old 07-12-2016, 06:18 AM   #123 (permalink)
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Bro you can't just post an abstract and call it a case.


Pay the money so we can see the details and then have a proper discussion about it.
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Old 07-12-2016, 06:24 AM   #124 (permalink)
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Ain't calling it a case just throwing it out there that certain genes appear more frequently in different races and sub races. They're not all limited to physical features and it's amazing that anyone would buy that they are

And more importantly science never had a universal conference and called it donezo on race. It's just a faux pas to discuss it in western culture.
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Old 07-12-2016, 06:54 AM   #125 (permalink)
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I just disagree with the notion that there always has to be a dissenting opinion. It has to be allowed, but in the end if we all voluntarily agree on something that's a good thing. I think geeno would agree (correct me if I'm wrong), as he seems to value homogeneity.
The big 'IF'. People mostly not gonna agree 'voluntarily', and if forced, it might/would be compliance under threat of whatever.

If, if everybody did things MY way, the world would not be perfect, but would be a better place. In MY opinion, anyways, , ,

-c-
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Old 07-12-2016, 10:01 AM   #126 (permalink)
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The abstract on the second link poses way more questions than answers.....

I'd be interest to read more on and into that study.
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Old 07-12-2016, 12:33 PM   #127 (permalink)
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Here's a pretty good essay on the above research:
https://scientiasalon.wordpress.com/...reality-check/

“Even if MAOA-2R is causally linked with antisocial behaviors, it is not common enough in African Americans to solely account for crime rates in blacks”
Kevin Beaver, 1 of 3 authors of said research paper.
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Old 07-12-2016, 01:25 PM   #128 (permalink)
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"solely"

It just happens to possibly be more common in blacks.
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Old 07-12-2016, 01:41 PM   #129 (permalink)
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Genes are largely present and expressed by environmental factors. The word solely has a lot of significance in a study that has been interpreted in such a deterministic way. There is, without a doubt, many more factors to consider.

Plus-- the part of the essay that MN quoted shows that the author did not see enough of the gene in folks of colour to attribute it as being a racial issue.
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Old 07-12-2016, 02:04 PM   #130 (permalink)
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I believe most of such genetic differences ultimately have environmental origins. (Much like how race/culture/etc have environmental/geographical origins..)

It seems environment and behavior have a very significant impact on your dna.

Geeno, here is where im at.
Yes there are some biological differences between different races of human.
We evolved in super different places all over the world. Eating different unique food, vastly different sun intensities and ecology, vastly different societal structures, different everything really.
This could easily make one people from a certain area(race) different in various ways genetically. Switch certain proteins on our off. I mean, our skin melanin production is just that. Food intolerances, propensity to certain diseases etc.

As for behavioral traits, it is much harder to say. We still know so little about genetics/epigenetics honestly. I wouldn't rule it out though. For instance, a child might be more prone to certain behaviors if they inherited genes from their parents who have a history of such behavior. It is very debatable, but there is a strong chance that is true.
So multiply that by many generations, such as with race and culture, and i could see the sane holding true to some extent.

But much like the child, those are environment related changes and genes.

So say if your african-american anti-social gene thing is true, and that is a massive assumptive leap btw, here is mine:
Take the individual out of the environment responsible, and that gene will be bred out very quickly.



Tl;dr- That article should probably read "Poverty's Effects on Genetics
"

And honestly, it is crazy just how minute those biological differences are, given to how we have lived under such vastly different conditions.
We really are soooo similar.
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Old 07-12-2016, 02:10 PM   #131 (permalink)
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And really, where is the evidence that blacks are more prone to antisocial behavior?

Oh black people get angry and antisocial after a string of high profile police murders?
White people riot after a sports game!

Gang violence?
White people have shown equal propensity.

Drug use?
Nope. Same

... ?
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Old 07-12-2016, 03:01 PM   #132 (permalink)
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The U.S. National Institutes of Health has launched the largest-ever ($12m) study that will follow 20k black women with breast cancer, comparing them to thousands of women who do not have cancer, to investigate the genetic and biological influences on breast cancer risk. Research has shown that black women are at a greater risk of dying from breast cancer than their white counterparts.

NYTimes.com - Why do more black women die of breast cancer? a study aims to find out

The million dollar question is: why would anyone believe that a purely arbitrary social category such as "black women" contributes to our knowledge of the genetic factors that influence death rates? We may as well study breast cancer rates in unicorns.

$12m down the drain, what a surprise. Valuable research, alternatively, might have helped us to better understand the more immediate and obvious risk factors for a given health outcome: economic disparities and poverty, inequality in access to care, exposure environmental and occupational hazards, and the human cost of fee-for-service health care.
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Old 07-12-2016, 03:20 PM   #133 (permalink)
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Put every human being on the planet in a perfect environment from birth and the biological differences wouldn't warrant any kind of discussion.
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Old 07-12-2016, 05:23 PM   #134 (permalink)
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The U.S. National Institutes of Health has launched the largest-ever ($12m) study that will follow 20k black women with breast cancer, comparing them to thousands of women who do not have cancer, to investigate the genetic and biological influences on breast cancer risk. Research has shown that black women are at a greater risk of dying from breast cancer than their white counterparts.

NYTimes.com - Why do more black women die of breast cancer? a study aims to find out

The million dollar question is: why would anyone believe that a purely arbitrary social category such as "black women" contributes to our knowledge of the genetic factors that influence death rates? We may as well study breast cancer rates in unicorns.

$12m down the drain, what a surprise. Valuable research, alternatively, might have helped us to better understand the more immediate and obvious risk factors for a given health outcome: economic disparities and poverty, inequality in access to care, exposure environmental and occupational hazards, and the human cost of fee-for-service health care.
Follow the links on the author's names from the abstract and you'll see a lot of interesting studies of a similar nature.
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Old 07-12-2016, 08:18 PM   #135 (permalink)
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That is an exceptional photo.
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Old 07-12-2016, 10:45 PM   #136 (permalink)
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Nothing wrong with studying race when it comes to health. If its useful, study it. There's blood pressure medications (iirc) that work better with black people, and ones that work better with white people. We may not know why, but if we can use an easily observable trait to give people better treatment that's a good thing, no fucking doubt about it.


On an unrelated note, since we've delved into the wacky weird world of human genetics, anyone ever hear that men with an extra Y chromosome are significantly more likely to face criminal convictions in their lifetime? It makes me think that the fact that man suffer far far far higher incarceration rates than women might be partly due to biological differences in aggression, not just cultural factors.
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Old 07-13-2016, 02:57 AM   #137 (permalink)
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Quote:
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"solely"

It just happens to possibly be more common in blacks.
I just want to point out that this research was done on 133 American black males. 6% had the 2R. That's like almost 8 people. The incidence of violent behavior was 5.6% (out of 133). This equates to about 7.4 people.

Hardly large enough to be definitive, but enough for a narrative on a racist media site.
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Old 07-13-2016, 03:30 AM   #138 (permalink)
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Quote:
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On an unrelated note, since we've delved into the wacky weird world of human genetics, anyone ever hear that men with an extra Y chromosome are significantly more likely to face criminal convictions in their lifetime? It makes me think that the fact that man suffer far far far higher incarceration rates than women might be partly due to biological differences in aggression, not just cultural factors.
I remember some guys trying to use that as their defense in court.

That research has been discounted. They now believe that 1 in 1000 males have this, but they call it 'rare'. 1 in 1000 doesn't seem rare to me.

Here's an article:
XYY Syndrome - NORD (National Organization for Rare Disorders)

I've been into genetics since my plant breeding days. I find it fascinating.
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